Rear tire backwards on frt of trike

[kenvb]

Jay,,you say that OEM HD tire is no good. When I had the Honda dealership and my own little repair shop I sold hundreds of cheapest tires available , Chen Sin tires to fellow Cheapskate Gold Wingers with no issues. and lots of issues with expensive Dunlop Elites ??and Michelins. go figure.

 

[jfingalls]

Let's talk facts and not unfounded opinions. The reason that was established for reverse rotation is not valid (as has been proven in a survey within TrikeTalk.com) so why discuss it. Just don't do it. Safety is the real issue and, yes, hydroplaning is a serious problem when it does happen to you - so please be careful! The thread design dictates the recommended rotation. Most good cycle repair shops will refuse to reverse mount the tire on the front to keep their DOT accreditation and fear of liability.

 

[Calgary]

Let's talk facts and not unfounded opinions. The reason that was established for reverse rotation is not valid (as has been proven in a survey within TrikeTalk.com) so why discuss it. Just don't do it. Safety is the real issue and, yes, hydroplaning is a serious problem when it does happen to you - so please be careful! The thread design dictates the recommended rotation. Most good cycle repair shops will refuse to reverse mount the tire on the front to keep their DOT accreditation and fear of liability.

Ditto Be Safe!

 

[riverrat]

As far as talking facts, I'm not sure that there are any other than the fact that a rear bias ply sportbike tire ran up front will get you better results than a front tire will regardless of which direction you mount it. The rest of the "facts" are mainly just opinions.

 

[Solidbob]

Don't take the Forums word, try the manufacturers... FYI

From an Email

From Michelin Tire Company:

September 08, 2013

Bob ,

Per our phone conversation regarding the Michelin Pilot Activ, this tire can be used on the front of a trike mounted to run in reverse.

Many consumers use a rear tire and turn it around (tire is mounted opposite to the directional arrows on the sidewall of the tire) to be used on the front.

The rear tire tread pattern is designed for acceleration while the front tire tread pattern is designed for braking and stopping. So the tread pattern must be reversed to change it from acceleration to braking and stopping.

The rear tire is used in these applications because it provides longer wear.

Thanks for choosing Michelin. We appreciate your business.

It is our goal to ensure that your issue has been resolved or you question answered to your satisfaction. If we can assist you further, please respond to this email or call us at 1-800-847-3435 (toll free) between 8:00AM and 8:00PM Eastern Time Monday through Friday or between 8:30AM and 4:30PM Eastern Time on Saturday.

Sincerely,
Dale
Michelin North America
Consumer Care Department
Certified Michelin Product Expert



From AVON


Avon Response.... (July 17, 2013)

From Avon Tire Company
Tires Directional Arrows Explained By Avon Tyres
Published by Cyril Huze August 23rd, 2009 in Builders, Editorial and Wheels.

Before we can talk about directional arrows you must first understand a bit about tread patterns. There are many different tread patterns but there is one main reason to have any tread and that is to disperse water (dust, dirt). A tread pattern can be designed to disperse more water by making it rotate in only one direction. Thus, the need for directional arrows. The arrow tells you which way to mount a tire for maximum water dispersal.

Another, less apparent reason for directional arrows is the tread splice. What is a tread splice? When a tire is manufactured the tread portion of the tire starts out as a long flat strip. This strip is wrapped around the tire and the two ends are cut on an angle so one end overlaps the other rather than having square cut ends. This overlapping point or splice offers a bigger surface area to bond together, rather than the small surface area provided by square cut ends. (Imagine gluing your fingertips together, as opposed to gluing along the entire length of your fingers laid on top of each other. Like an angled splice, the overlapping fingers result in a much stronger bond). To further ensure the strength of this bond along the tread splice the directional arrow will show you which way to mount the tire so that when the rider is “on the gas”; the acceleration force on the rear tire is pressing the splice together, rather than peeling it back.

As for braking, 80 % of the braking should take place in the front on most bikes. Therefore, the front tread splice is run in the opposite direction than that of the rear, so when the rider is on the brakes, he’s not peeling the tread splice back.

If you are using a tire that has a directional arrow for rear rotation only and for some reason you want to put it on the front, make sure it is rotating in the opposite direction so you don’t aggravate the tread splice.
Avon Tyres.

:10:

 

[slick rick]

Let's talk facts and not unfounded opinions. The reason that was established for reverse rotation is not valid (as has been proven in a survey within TrikeTalk.com) so why discuss it. Just don't do it. Safety is the real issue and, yes, hydroplaning is a serious problem when it does happen to you - so please be careful! The thread design dictates the recommended rotation. Most good cycle repair shops will refuse to reverse mount the tire on the front to keep their DOT accreditation and fear of liability.

ThumbUpThumbUpThumbUp:Agree::Agree:,,,to each his own though !!!

 

[pcombe]

ThumbUpThumbUpThumbUp:Agree::Agree:,,,to each his own though !!!

Hi slickster: the horsepucky I read on some threads astound me?
I run the back tire in reverse on my trike with absolutely no issues whatsoever regardless of those who's opinion is controversial to mine. opinion goes out the window when the rubber meets the road.

 

[jfingalls]

Hello TrikeTalk.com Friends, Is it possible we have been given erroneous information from the Michilen Representative? For our combined education, below is an excerpt (assembly process only) from Michilen's Motorcycle Tire manufacturing process. Even though they use the term Radial tire, I'm told the design and manufacturing process is the same for all motorcycle tires.

I have highlighted the strongest reasons for keeping the rotation of the tire as marked on the tire.

ASSEMBLY
Radial tire construction is a two-stage process: building the carcass, then applying the reinforcing plies and tread. Carcass assembly begins on a "tire drum,"--a rotating cylinder with a flexible center that allows the edges of the drum to be brought together. A thin, airtight sheet of synthetic rubber is first laid down on the drum, then topped with a casing ply containing parallel fabric cords for strength. The tire bead, a wire (or sometimes Kevlar) hoop, is put over the drum next, and the casing is folded over the bead wire. Once the bead is sealed, other compounds--well over a dozen, in most cases--are added. Tough, flexible sidewalls are laid down and the tire drum is "inflated" to give the carcass its shape. This completes the first stage.

Stage two begins with the addition of a strengthening cord (typically Kevlar or Aramid) to support the plies. This cord is laid crosswise to the casing plies to form shape-retaining triangles. Reinforcing tread plies are laid down on top of the cord, engineered to provide directional stability and mechanical resistance. This is the end of the second assembly stage; from here the "green" tire carcass will go to the curing mold, where it will be given its markings and tread pattern. A single person assembles a single tire, with the process taking anywhere from three to 10 minutes depending on the type of tire.

 

[FRR]

Don't take the Forums word, try the manufacturers... FYI

From an Email

From Michelin Tire Company:

September 08, 2013

Bob ,

Per our phone conversation regarding the Michelin Pilot Activ, this tire can be used on the front of a trike mounted to run in reverse.

Many consumers use a rear tire and turn it around (tire is mounted opposite to the directional arrows on the sidewall of the tire) to be used on the front.

The rear tire tread pattern is designed for acceleration while the front tire tread pattern is designed for braking and stopping. So the tread pattern must be reversed to change it from acceleration to braking and stopping.

The rear tire is used in these applications because it provides longer wear.

Thanks for choosing Michelin. We appreciate your business.

It is our goal to ensure that your issue has been resolved or you question answered to your satisfaction. If we can assist you further, please respond to this email or call us at 1-800-847-3435 (toll free) between 8:00AM and 8:00PM Eastern Time Monday through Friday or between 8:30AM and 4:30PM Eastern Time on Saturday.

Sincerely,
Dale
Michelin North America
Consumer Care Department
Certified Michelin Product Expert



From AVON


Avon Response.... (July 17, 2013)

From Avon Tire Company
Tires Directional Arrows Explained By Avon Tyres
Published by Cyril Huze August 23rd, 2009 in Builders, Editorial and Wheels.

Before we can talk about directional arrows you must first understand a bit about tread patterns. There are many different tread patterns but there is one main reason to have any tread and that is to disperse water (dust, dirt). A tread pattern can be designed to disperse more water by making it rotate in only one direction. Thus, the need for directional arrows. The arrow tells you which way to mount a tire for maximum water dispersal.

Another, less apparent reason for directional arrows is the tread splice. What is a tread splice? When a tire is manufactured the tread portion of the tire starts out as a long flat strip. This strip is wrapped around the tire and the two ends are cut on an angle so one end overlaps the other rather than having square cut ends. This overlapping point or splice offers a bigger surface area to bond together, rather than the small surface area provided by square cut ends. (Imagine gluing your fingertips together, as opposed to gluing along the entire length of your fingers laid on top of each other. Like an angled splice, the overlapping fingers result in a much stronger bond). To further ensure the strength of this bond along the tread splice the directional arrow will show you which way to mount the tire so that when the rider is “on the gas”; the acceleration force on the rear tire is pressing the splice together, rather than peeling it back.

As for braking, 80 % of the braking should take place in the front on most bikes. Therefore, the front tread splice is run in the opposite direction than that of the rear, so when the rider is on the brakes, he’s not peeling the tread splice back.

If you are using a tire that has a directional arrow for rear rotation only and for some reason you want to put it on the front, make sure it is rotating in the opposite direction so you don’t aggravate the tread splice.
Avon Tyres.

:10:

You just sold me!

 

[slick rick]

Hi slickster: the horsepucky I read on some threads astound me?
I run the back tire in reverse on my trike with absolutely no issues whatsoever regardless of those who's opinion is controversial to mine. opinion goes out the window when the rubber meets the road.

Horse puckey is that like horse POOPEY ????

 

[pcombe]

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<img src="images/misc/quote_icon.png" alt="Quote" /> Originally Posted by <strong>tbear</strong>
<a href="showthread.php?p=224195#post224195" rel="nofollow"><img class="inlineimg" src="images/buttons/viewpost-right.png" alt="View Post" /></a>
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<div class="message">OK PEOPLE!! I have a Harley Triglide. Are you all saying that a NON-RADIAL REAR TIRE IN REVERSE should go on the front..? Is that the Consenous going on to this Subject?<img src="images/smilies/gah.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Gah" class="inlineimg" /></div>

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</div> I do not run a radial tire backward on my trike.<br />
The rear tire I use in backward rotation on my trike is not a radial.<br />
It is the same exact size as the original front tire and I have no performance issues with it whatsoever.

 

[Solidbob]

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<img src="images/misc/quote_icon.png" alt="Quote" /> Originally Posted by <strong>jfingalls</strong>
<a href="showthread.php?p=224671#post224671" rel="nofollow"><img class="inlineimg" src="images/buttons/viewpost-right.png" alt="View Post" /></a>
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<div class="message">Hello TrikeTalk.com Friends, Is it possible we have been given erroneous information from the Michilen Representative? For our combined education, below is an excerpt (assembly process only) from Michilen's Motorcycle Tire manufacturing process. Even though they use the term Radial tire, I'm told the design and manufacturing process is the same for all motorcycle tires. <br />
<br />
I have highlighted the strongest reasons for keeping the rotation of the tire as marked on the tire.<br />
<br />
<b>ASSEMBLY</b><br />
Radial tire construction is a two-stage process: building the carcass, then applying the reinforcing plies and tread. Carcass assembly begins on a "tire drum,"--a rotating cylinder with a flexible center that allows the edges of the drum to be brought together. A thin, airtight sheet of synthetic rubber is first laid down on the drum, then topped with a casing ply containing parallel fabric cords for strength. The tire bead, a wire (or sometimes Kevlar) hoop, is put over the drum next, and the casing is folded over the bead wire. Once the bead is sealed, other compounds--well over a dozen, in most cases--are added. Tough, flexible sidewalls are laid down and the tire drum is "inflated" to give the carcass its shape. This completes the first stage.<br />
Stage two begins with the addition of a strengthening cord (typically Kevlar or Aramid) to support the plies.

This cord is laid crosswise to the casing plies to form shape-retaining triangles. <b><font color="#0000cd"><u>Reinforcing tread plies are laid down on top of the cord, engineered to provide directional stability and mechanical resistance. </u></font></b>This is the end of the second assembly stage; from here the "green" tire carcass will go to the curing mold, where it will be given its markings and tread pattern. A single person assembles a single tire, with the process taking anywhere from three to 10 minutes depending on the type of tire.</div>

</div>
</div>
</div>As your article states this is for Radial Tires and it is very true! You have been told wrong!! <br />
<br />
Design and process is different... It's been stated numerous times of various Forums.<br />
<br />
However BIAS Ply construction is totally different, look that up next. That is why Rear Bias is used on the front of a trike for much better mileage as the tread is thicker and the sidewalls are stronger and won't roll under on corners.<br />
<br />
JUST FYI...

 

[cjmitch]

When you reverse the tire, look at the tread pattern now, and you will see that it is now channeling the water to the centre of the tire, not away to the outside!

that is not true with the MPA vs. the stock Gl1800 tire.
With normal rotation the treads do not match, reverse the MPA, and the treads directional tread matches.

 

[Veritas44]

​

 

[Calgary]

You're so right Veritas44 - this has been pretty much beaten to death! :Agree::Agree::Agree:

 

[Papa Zook]

Avon is about to release a series of TRIKE TIRES. Yes a purpose built trike tire. They have been in contact with me and are in the beta testing phase at this moment.

 

[Calgary]

Avon is about to release a series of TRIKE TIRES. Yes a purpose built trike tire. They have been in contact with me and are in the beta testing phase at this moment.

Bazooka
Would that include front and rear tires?

Would the front tires be radials.

Is there an indication how long the beta testing phase will take?

 

[Papa Zook]

Bazooka
Would that include front and rear tires?

Would the front tires be radials.

Is there an indication how long the beta testing phase will take?

This is front tires and has been in the works for quiet a while now, if you remember my original posting about this to the Industry News Forum when they first contacted me. The beta testing is in full process and they were recently seeking beta testers contact info from us both in the USA and the UK, which they now have. Not 100% sure if these are radials. I will report more as I receive more info from my Avon contact.

 

[John Luciano]

I won't run another Radial on the front of my trike. They would have to offer it to me for free to test it

 

[Calgary]

Thanx Bazooka, I just found this info on the avonmoto.com site. Available Q2 2014!

4110011 63V
3.50 - 4.00
647 / 25.5
Revs per km/mile
517 / 827


Cobra Trike available Q2 2014
Part Number
Cobra AV71 Front
90000020646
European Code
Tire Size
130/70R18
Service Index
Rec Rim
MT3.50
Rim min-max
Overall Width mm/inches
128 / 5.0
Overall Diameter mm/inches
Depth mm
4.7
*Reinforced |
WWhite Wall (AV71 120/70-21 front available Q2 2014 • Cobra Trike tire available Q2 2014)
MT90B16 equivalent to 130/90B16 | 140/90B16 equivalent to MU85B16 | †Triumph OEM tire

 

[Solidbob]

Sounds like Radial Specs, not Bias Ply

 

[Texas2010MT]

I have done this recently on my 2010 gold wing Motor Trike Conversion. I have just over 2000 miles on the Michelin tire and I have been extremely happy with the ride and feel of this tire.

Also the tire still looks brand new.

 

[Gold Rush]

I read a lot of articles about trikers putting rear tires backwards on front wheel of there trikes? have any one of you done this. and why? this old Lehman rides very rough and needs a frt tire anyway.

There are many opinions about forward/reverse rotation when using the rear bias ply on the front of a trike. Several tire manufacturers have stated it's a good idea but many of us still are resistant to mounting the tire reversed. For what it's worth here is my rational:

1. If you have a linked brake system and it's still active then mounting in reverse is not so important because no matter what the front and rear breaks are working in unison. Granted on the GL1800 it's a 70/30 or 30/70 split but at least they are both braking so the stress on that bias ply is not as significant as some think.

2. If you do not have a linked brake system and primarily use the front brake for stopping then MOUNT IN REVERSE! I can't say that strong enough. These tires we are using are designed to go on much lighter bikes and the stress of stopping a 1500 pound trike will quite likely do damage to the tire.

3. If you do not have a linked brake system and use mostly rear or a combination front/rear brake procedure then I'd say you will probably never cause any damage due to stopping stress.

I've read a few forum posts that seem to indicate running in reverse rotation may cause premature tire ware, vibration, and noise. I have had four tires on my trike. All have been mounted reversed. There is a new BT-45 setting in my store room waiting to go on when needed. It will be mounted in forward rotation. Then I'll know for myself if there are any adverse affects. I do have a linked brake system and also manually apply a combination front/rear so there is no danger of tire carcass damage. It's going to take a while but I'll report back when I have something definitive to report. :xszpv::xszpv:

 

[kenvb]

local bike shop wont mount it backwards ....so mounted it the normal way.

I have done this recently on my 2010 gold wing Motor Trike Conversion. I have just over 2000 miles on the tire and I have been extremely happy with the ride and feel of this tire.

Also the tire still looks brand new.

 

[Texas2010MT]

local bike shop wont mount it backwards ....so mounted it the normal way.

Interesting. My local bike shop guy even asked me forward or reverse and said that Michelin even recommended them that way

 

[Gold Rush]

local bike shop wont mount it backwards ....so mounted it the normal way.

Not uncommon..... Ours requires a signed liability waver but they will do it. I even printed out the manufacturer's statements and showed them but it fell on deaf ears. Not a problem. I singed and they mounted in reverse..... :xszpv::xszpv:

 

[Golden Dakota]

The problem is not wear and tear! The problem is water dispersion. Look at the tread pattern how the water on the road surface you are riding on is channelled away from the centre of the tire to the outsides of the tire when it is mounted the correct way. Now look at what happens when you mount it in reverse direction - the water is now channelled from the outside of the tire to the centre of the tire! You won't notice a difference on dry roads - you could notice a serious difference on wet roads. IMHO this safety factor is more important than trying to get an extra 1,000 miles of wear out of your tire!

 

[John Luciano]

Golden. Have you ridden in the rain with one reversed.. I have. Rode in rain that I passed cars that pulled over. Drove down a high way with 50 mile an hour winds and blinding rain. Any one in there right mind would have pulled over. My front tire NEVER. Hydroplaned. Ask me about the 2 10" water pontoons on the back. I thought I was in Hawaii. Only thing missing was a grass skirt. The front was as solid as a ROCK. Everyone speculates what they think it will be like. You have to go with your own conscience.

 

[irmagoo]

this rear tire on front is tuff to get a straight answer about.
I e-mailed Michelin and got this:

Hello Mike,

Thank you for your email. We welcome the opportunity to serve you.




In regards to the email you sent stating:
---------------------------------------------------------------------
hi I want to know if your pilot active 130/80v-18 rear tire will be ok for my 3and half x18 inch front wheel on my trike, or would you recommend something else?..
thank you mike
---------------------------------------------------------------------
​

Mike, the Michelin Pilot Activ 130/80-17 is a rear tire.

Michelin's position is we do not condone the use of the Pilot Active rear tire mounted in the reverse direction on the front of Trikes.

We appreciate your business and thank you for choosing Michelin.

It is our goal to ensure that your issue has been resolved or your question answered to your satisfaction. If we can assist you further, please respond to this email or call us at 1-800-346-4098 (toll free) between 8:00AM and 5:00PM Eastern Time Monday through Friday or between 8:30AM and 4:30PM Eastern Time on Saturday.

Sincerely,

Colesta
Consumer Care Department
Certified Michelin Product Expert

so I don't get it.... I e-mailed back and asked what tire they do recommend on trike but have not head back from them yet . I will post any response..
what I originally asked them was would 130/80x18 tire fit my 3.5 inch wide 18inch rim :xzqxz:
magoo​

 

[Calgary]

Thanx for sharing Magoo!

So many differing experiences, opinions, observations, speculations and outright guesses when it comes to this subject!

Fortunately, the collective experiences of seasoned trike riders will gel here on TT and we will all benefit; emerging with the safest application!

A big thank you to all of you high milers who have gone through multiple tire change cycles and continue to report back with the results.