Educate me on Tri Glide heat

[POPSHD]

New 2020 Tri Glide owner here. I previously put 42k on my 2014 Limited. Prior to that, I put 16k on a 2010 Street Glide and had a Dyna Wide Glide with 10k before that. I've experienced engine/exhaust heat on Harley's. My Limited was probably the coolest since it was a Twin Cooled Rushmore. It did have a cat-less header, so not really apples-to-apples comparison.

Educate me on heat when it comes to the Tri Glide. I've already noticed that the cooling fans come on WAY more often than on my Limited. Yesterday, the outside temp was 72-degrees with noticeable engine/exhaust heat. I understand that much of the heat emanates from the cat in the header and removing that will help. Also, stock Harley's are tuned very lean to meet EPA standards and that creates more heat.

All that said, do Tri Glides have more heat than 2-wheel bikes? Does the rear end of the Tri Glide make it warmer by not allowing more air flow to cool things? Again, educate this new Tri Glide owner. Much thanks!

 

[rhino 2]

All that said, do Tri Glides have more heat than 2-wheel bikes? Does the rear end of the Tri Glide make it warmer by not allowing more air flow to cool things? Again, educate this new Tri Glide owner. Much thanks!

Yes......More heat, And the rear end [Fenders] hold the heat also...

 

[Sully]

Installing Love Jugs Fan will help cool the motor along with air Vents and a Tank lift kit. Floorboard extenders also.

 

[Wmitz]

As mentioned love jug fans are supposed to work well. Floorboard extensions move the legs out about an inch on each side. At this time I am thinking about the DK Customs tank lift with the wings to increase air flow over the motor. I also might go with the remote oil filter and cooler depending on cash flow. Try angling the left lower vent in a little to direct the air towards the motor/rear jug, I found this helps a little if your moving. A decatted header can be found on eBay fairly cheap, same as all the m8 touring bikes. Also the m8’s run slightly richer the the twin cams, but.......

 

[kwkride]

I put 34,000 miles on a '14 Ultra Limited and then went to a '14 Tri Glide. I didn't notice any difference in heat. Also, the Tri Glide came with V&H Dresser Duals (with no cat). I took them off and went back to a stock head pipe with the cat. Heat hasn't been an issue at all.

 

[Fearless]

Heat management translates into Motor longevity the cooler the motor runs the longer it should run stronger. Heat tolerance or intolerance is a individual issue. When I first installed a Power vision tuner and dialed up the Engine Temperature on the monitor I just about passed out. I knew it was hot but wow 285 to 290 degrees going through small towns (which we have many here in PA).

I had to do something to make a long story short... I raised the Fuel tank DK customs deluxe 2" lift, installed DK Customs Air deflectors, extended floor boards, Power Vision tuner really helped,and I removed the so called heat deflector on the left side mid frame to let the built up hot air somewhere to go. And last but by no means least Love Jug Mini Might Fans. In 2009 the Triglides had no Cat. unless it was a California model, and then it was in the right muffler or so I have been told.

Now we can cruise around with the temperatures 220 to 230 degrees on 80 to 85 degree day and leave a slow speed town at 245 degrees. The expensive part is the Tuner you chose and the Cooling fans, for what we pay for these wonderful machines it is not really an issue to make them last longer and run stronger. Travel safe Fred



P.S. I am now looking at replacing the OEM oil cooler with a fan assisted one just insurance against heat related failures.

 

[DK Custom Products]

New 2020 Tri Glide owner here. I previously put 42k on my 2014 Limited. Prior to that, I put 16k on a 2010 Street Glide and had a Dyna Wide Glide with 10k before that. I've experienced engine/exhaust heat on Harley's. My Limited was probably the coolest since it was a Twin Cooled Rushmore. It did have a cat-less header, so not really apples-to-apples comparison.

Educate me on heat when it comes to the Tri Glide. I've already noticed that the cooling fans come on WAY more often than on my Limited. Yesterday, the outside temp was 72-degrees with noticeable engine/exhaust heat. I understand that much of the heat emanates from the cat in the header and removing that will help. Also, stock Harley's are tuned very lean to meet EPA standards and that creates more heat.

All that said, do Tri Glides have more heat than 2-wheel bikes? Does the rear end of the Tri Glide make it warmer by not allowing more air flow to cool things? Again, educate this new Tri Glide owner. Much thanks!

Congrats on your new 2020 TG! I know you gotta be enjoying it!

Last question first- Yes, the Trikes have more felt heat And actual engine heat than the 2 wheelers.

Reasons are less air flowing past and on behind the bike. Hits the back fenders and swirls, and it weighs more and has more wind resistance, so engine has to work harder.

Harley has done a better job on the M8 of reducing felt heat, but the engines run just as hot as the Twin Cams. This causes a loss in performance and reduced engine longevity. There are many reasons for this, but one of the biggest is that there is no where for the heat in the oil to dissipate on the Tri Glides. See the video below-



There are many other reasons, below are a couple of links that outline the challenges and solutions.

LINK 1 on excessive heat

LINK 2 on excessive heat

Below is another one of our Heat Test videos that you may find useful-



The good news is that the M8's do not run nearly as lean from the factory as the Twin Cams. While they can benefit from a tune, it is not as important on the M8's as it is on the TC's. There is a report below, showing AFR's and other very interesting info on the M8 engine.

M8 Engine Report LINK with many Dyno and AFR charts.

Kevin

 

[POPSHD]

All good posts here, Getting rid of the head breathers ( that is hot and moisture filled oil) going back into your engine is a big plus

That oil goo is bad Ju Ju for the tops of the pistons. It can create hot spots leading to spark knock, detonation and un wanted heat, slowly destroying your engine and robbing you of power

Thanks, Jack! Not sure I am following you on "head breathers". Can you explain what I need to get rid of? Thanks again!

 

[MDF48]

This will explain it.

Thanks, Jack! Not sure I am following you on "head breathers". Can you explain what I need to get rid of? Thanks again!

This video will explain what Jack is talking about.

 

[rayg5102]

Does making these "changes" on a 2020, such as raising the fuel tank or the oil filter location violate any warranty or do we just do it for the befifit of the bike and say FU HD...?

 

[MontgomeryLittle]

Does making these "changes" on a 2020, such as raising the fuel tank or the oil filter location violate any warranty or do we just do it for the befifit of the bike and say FU HD...?

Probably, but I guess I've done worse to prevent damage outside of warranty and increase personal comfort at the same time.

All that said my 2019 Tri-Glide, stock, except for Road-Glide fairing, has been tolerable for me. Broke in from Florida to home. We hit Birmingham and the temp was 101* on I-65. An accident had us to a crawl for awhile. Luckily people were nice and let us over when we needed to get moving.

Wifes 2011 Tri-Glide was a little different. First she is about 5'1" and the bike didn't fit her. She wouldn't let me touch it until it blistered her leg. Then it was "fix this damn thing". Put 2" pull back bars on it, Floor board extenders, Fuel moto package with PV tuner, breather back plate, headpipes and mufflers. Added an "EVO" style round breather cover to keep it off her leg more. Then a

Captain Itch crotch cooler over the stock one.

Also had a seat built for her from Russell Day Long. Oh almost forgot one more thing I did to it early on was change the thermostat for the oil cooler. From Harley this is a non replaceable part, you must purchase the oil filter mounting bracket to replace the thermostat. Don't remember the web site or the guys name but he found the vendor that made the thermostats for Harley and had some made at a lower temp, don't remember the ranges now either but if I recall correctly it was about 20* lower. But even with that after an amount

of time temps stabilized to around the same 220* if I remember correctly. For what its worth a H-D tech friend of mine told me the twinkie motors are not warmed up until they reach somewhere in this range. And again I don't remember exactly.

Only got rid of 2 Harleys I've ever owned. A 1948 and a 1995. I still got two pans a shovel, Iron head, 2 twinkies and now an M-8. They all run hot I guess just in a different way. Air cooled motors you know. Wish now though I had kept my Evo.

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[Jack Klarich]

Does making these "changes" on a 2020, such as raising the fuel tank or the oil filter location violate any warranty or do we just do it for the befifit of the bike and say FU HD...?

I dunno, since Harley entered into the Consent decree ( read it here https://www.epa.gov/enforcement/consent-decree-harley-davidson) they have tightened up on what( MAY) cause your warranty to be void with a host of other aftermarket parts. I believe this to be dishonest and non sense. Check with your selling dealer on what they say just for grins. Keep in mind this too will change dealer to dealer with very little reasoning.

 

[tfdeputydawg]

Does making these "changes" on a 2020, such as raising the fuel tank or the oil filter location violate any warranty or do we just do it for the befifit of the bike and say FU HD...?

Depends on the dealer and if a factory rep gets involved in the issue!

Years ago, when I purchased my 1st Harley, I read the warranty info that came with the bike + the info that was printed in the accessory catalog.

Paraphrased:

Any factory unapproved part or modification made or not performed by a qualified tech in an authorized dealership may be reason to void part or all of the bikes warranty.

So while the selling dealer may cover an issue, even though an unapproved part or mod was made, you are in danger of a voided warranty claim, if you have an issue miles from the selling dealer and must use another dealer that will not cover it or a factory rep gets involved.

 

[Gorilla]

gee I wonder what causes the drop in oil temp? The oil temp sensor is located in the oil pan not anywhere near the love jugs.

 

[Gorilla]

The major results do not happen at normal riding speed out on the highway with air temps below 90. With temps above 90 the jugs keep my oil temp down around 230. If I run into traffic delays or slow riding through a town/city, the jugs also keep my oil temp down around 230. In both those situations with the jugs turned off my oil temps will climb above 250 to 270. Even higher if action is not taken. I've even allowed it to do that and at 250+ I have turned the jugs back on and the temps will SLOWLY start back down. The key is to prevent the temps from getting up there to start with. In normal highway situations and temps below 90 the jugs do NOT make much difference. I ride a lot about 12k per year and I encounter high air temp and slow riding conditions so the jugs do the job for me. Also I run a Dakota Digital gauge for my oil temp which gives me good data.

"DK" Products has an extensive testing of the jugs on their site that also supports the effectiveness of the jugs.

But again YOUR riding style may not get the results that I have or the DK testing. No product works the same for everyone. Thank you for your input it lets people out there to known that fact. What works for one may not work for you.

 

[Sailor26]

Installed DK Oil filter relocation kit/oil cooler and Love Jug Fans. My trike fans rarely come on.

 

[DK Custom Products]

On the surface that sounds right. HOWEVER, it is based on a faulty assumption. "really was by blowing air on the sensor"

The Engine Temperature Sensor is buried deep in the metal of the cylinder head. The only way the fan blowing can reduce the temperature that the sensor reads is by cooling the cylinder head around the sensor. That is what you want to happen...actually cool the cylinder heads.

To be clear, the sensor is not reading temps that are outside the engine (where the fans are) it is reading the temperature inside the metal of the head, right near the combustion chamber.

That said, I have heard of a few people that have installed fans and oil coolers that have reported that they have not experienced any significant drop in engine or oil temps. I don't know why.

I have personally done extensive testing on a half dozen different bikes and trikes and always seen a very measurable drop in temps. (see video and chart below)

One thing is sure, if the factory temps are not brought down, there will be accelerated engine wear, just like you experienced.

Full report related to the above chart can be seen HERE.

Kevin

 

[MDF48]

Works for me.

I have been using Wards FCS fans for 3 years on my TGU. As we all know they are out of business, but are basically identical to the Love Jugs model Mighty Mites. I also have the DK oil filter relocator and cooler.

My fans do work with a thermal switch that comes on at a set temp and they stay on all the time. When I stop and turn the bike off they continue running until the head temp drops to 155 degrees. Usually they just run for a couple of minutes unless it is in the high 80-90's outside temp range. I like this because when I just stop somewhere for a short time and get back on the bike, it is a lot cooler.

I don't keep records anymore on my temps but I run a PV tuner and it is always set to show 4 things on the display. Engine temp, water temp and two other items. I know that when I stop for traffic lights or other things the fans really help keep the head and water temps from rising as fast as they did before I installed the fans. Summer temps here always in 80-100 range.

I do not have an oil temp gauge, but if my head temps are lower the oil temps will eventually follow to some degree.

 

[DK Custom Products]

I hear you. Including the three you've mentioned (yourself, your father, & his friend), I've had 2 others that have reported the same thing.

What's crazy is that one of those two is in Canada also.

Of course, there may be others that I've never heard from.

I spent quite a bit of time with one of them, really trying to trace down why. Never could figure it out. It is a mystery to me why blowing air across the engine does not cool it down and why running oil thru an oil cooler does not cool the oil.

Oh, btw, I was in Canada last year and my fans and oil cooler worked just as well up there as down here, so it is not Canada. But you may have something when you mention it may be the Canadian bikes. :laugh:

Seriously though, I know it must have been frustrating to have a Trike that did not work properly.

Kevin

 

[Fearless]

I'm not sure where Harley puts the sensor for Engine temperature, however the PowerVision tells us our motor temperature stays between 230 and 248 degrees never see 250 degrees. But if I have an old timers moment and not turn them on it goes to 260 degrees and climbing in a heart beat once the motor has been heat soaked. This I think is critical for engine life to have the fans operational at all times and by the way if the motor is running I have the fans running. I can't speak for others only from my experience I will not run that air cooled engine without the fans Love Jugs or whatever is available in the future. Sorry to hear that some people do not have success managing heat with them. Travel safe Fred

 

[DK Custom Products]

I'm not sure where Harley puts the sensor for Engine temperature, however the PowerVision tells us our motor temperature stays between 230 and 248 degrees never see 250 degrees. But if I have an old timers moment and not turn them on it goes to 260 degrees and climbing in a heart beat once the motor has been heat soaked. This I think is critical for engine life to have the fans operational at all times and by the way if the motor is running I have the fans running. I can't speak for others only from my experience I will not run that air cooled engine without the fans Love Jugs or whatever is available in the future. Sorry to hear that some people do not have success managing heat with them. Travel safe Fred

Yes Fred, I agree with you. I have my fans on a manual switch, and every now and then I forget to turn it on. I'll be reminded when I glance at my PowerVision and see the Engine Temp higher than expected...then I realize I did not flip the fan switch.

Like you, I also run mine regardless of the ambient temperature...just yesterday I rode into work at 39 degrees. I had the fans on.

Does the front cylinder really need the fans on at 39 degrees, moving down the road? Nope. But the rear cylinder does not get anywhere near the air flow of the front cylinder, even at 70 mph. So, even in the cold, moving down the road, I will run the fans so that rear cylinder is getting some air flow.

Kevin

 

[Jack Klarich]

I hear you. Including the three you've mentioned (yourself, your father, & his friend), I've had 2 others that have reported the same thing.

What's crazy is that one of those two is in Canada also.

Of course, there may be others that I've never heard from.

I spent quite a bit of time with one of them, really trying to trace down why. Never could figure it out. It is a mystery to me why blowing air across the engine does not cool it down and why running oil thru an oil cooler does not cool the oil.

Oh, btw, I was in Canada last year and my fans and oil cooler worked just as well up there as down here, so it is not Canada. But you may have something when you mention it may be the Canadian bikes. :laugh:

Seriously though, I know it must have been frustrating to have a Trike that did not work properly.

Kevin

I wonder if those trikes were sumping to some degree? That could explain the overheating issues

If these were both first generation oil pumps that would explain alot also

 

[rae mendonca]

love jugs

I wonder if those trikes were sumping to some degree? That could explain the overheating issues

If these were both first generation oil pumps that would explain alot also

I don't know about my fathers trike but I am quite sure mine was not sumping in any way. I never had a loss of power, I never cruised at high speeds. My oil level never fluctuated. I check my oil every time I stopped for any reason as I was concerned about that.