Question About SUPERTRAPP Exhaust - Soliciting Opinions

[trikermutha]

trikermutha,
Here is what I am picking up tonight:

Sears: Online department store featuring appliances, tools, fitness equipment and more

Will this not work?

Thanks,
Rob

I bought the whole set thinking they would work and they did not. (Flex Head) I found the other wrench I sent you worked alot better. If you look under the bike there is a bracket with a lip that faces upward towards the lower trunk area and that is what makes it difficult to remove these bolts. If that muffler bracker was flat then yes the flex head would work fine,but thats not the case.
If you had the whole back end off not problems. But since we are working around the issue this is what we had to do. I tried 1/4 sockets etc with the tight space the only way was the wrench link I sent you.

 

[trikermutha]

I bought the whole set thinking they would work and they did not. (Flex Head) I found the other wrench I sent you worked alot better. If you look under the bike there is a bracket with a lip that faces upward towards the lower trunk area and that is what makes it difficult to remove these bolts. If that muffler bracker was flat then yes the flex head would work fine,but thats not the case.
If you had the whole back end off not problems. But since we are working around the issue this is what we had to do. I tried 1/4 sockets etc with the tight space the only way was the wrench link I sent you.

If you found a 90 deg rachet wrench that would work perfect. But I have not found one yet..

 

[M.A.T.]

trikermutha,
This wrench flexes 180 degrees (90 both ways) and will lock into those positions. And it has a 5 degree arc swing.

I wonder why there is a lip on that bracket? Sounds dumb.........just another thing to make it harder for guys like me probably........

I received the end caps yesterday and checked them out immediately. I thought they were going to be longer than they are. I'm more worried now about how the whole thing is going to look/function. I hope that the holes in the end cap at least clears the body. Otherwise I will have some of the exhaust shooting under the body........

Rob

 

[trikermutha]

well you will see why once you start the project on my suggestion. You can always return the wrenches if they didnt work out for you.

good luck as it is a tight area to work on since you are laying on the floor.

 

[M.A.T.]

trikermutha,
I am not doubting you at all. I am just curious why if I can get this wrench to go from 0 degrees, to a 30 degree angle, and ultimately to a 90 degree angle why it would not be the same or better than a true 30 degree angle fixed head. I'm trying to learn something. I can envision what you are talking about, I think. And I think I may be able to overcome the obstacle having the wheels off.

Oh wait, do you mean I need to go over the lip and down onto the heal of the bolt!!!???

Rob

 

[trikermutha]

trikermutha,
I am not doubting you at all. I am just curious why if I can get this wrench to go from 0 degrees, to a 30 degree angle, and ultimately to a 90 degree angle why it would not be the same or better than a true 30 degree angle fixed head. I'm trying to learn something. I can envision what you are talking about, I think. And I think I may be able to overcome the obstacle having the wheels off.

Oh wait, do you mean I need to go over the lip and down onto the heal of the bolt!!!???

Rob

there ya go its hard to explain on email..thats why you had to look at it first..

hope i helped some..

 

[M.A.T.]

trikermutha,
Actually I have not looked yet, I post while at work, between tasks, sorry to say, no internet at home (too far out in the woods for cable) except on my cell phone, and that's spotty........

I just put 2 and 2 together and that was the only logical explanation (kinda proud of myself considering this is me we are talking about).

So ok, since I am on board now, then if that "lip" in the bracket is the problem, I wonder if a true standard "Offset Wrench" would be best? It would be non-ratcheting but I have all day......

Now, they do have a ratcheting version shown here:

Sears: Online department store featuring appliances, tools, fitness equipment and more

But as you can see, these look like what I bought, just fixed at 25 degrees. They are in stock, and I could pick them up tonight on the way home.

The non-ratcheting version allows you to go over the lip better but I wonder if they might have too great a distance from the bolt to the bend at the handle part of the tool?

Sears: Online department store featuring appliances, tools, fitness equipment and more


I agree, e-mails and forum posts without pictures suck. If you PM me I would be glad to give you my phone number, I just don't want to publish it. That goes for any of you that don't have it already.

Do you think that lip is there to add strength to the bracket? If it serves no purpose, I wonder if that would be easy to grind off with a dremmel tool? Not like I plan on switching mufflers all the time but when I replace the header I bet I will have to take them off or at least loosen them to be able to slide them outta the way. Or am I wrong about that too?

Help?! That's an understatement! I just hope no of you guys ever give up on me. You (all) are a huge asset!!! I will never claim to know more than anyone about anything mechanically. I use what others offer to help guide me in the right direction, weather or not I stay on the path is my decision and I am the one responsible for my actions.

 

[trikermutha]

well my opnion the rachet one you show maybe have to big of a head on it, the non rachet one may work but I will not say it wont work. That link I sent you above is what I used and seemed to work best.

Dremel would work if you dont mind weaking those areas of the bracket. With all the vibration in that area and the rubber mount in that area it may end up cracking in the future. (just my thought)

If you just buy the 1/2 rachet wrench I linked you should be fine. Or yes you could use a non rachet type but with the short turn increments it may not work to well without a rachet type.

Just my thoughts but I would recommend looking at that area tonight and you will have a better idea what is going on.

Those lift brackets you will learn a few things too when you install. I would look at the lower mounting bolt of the shock. you may need to use a bottle jack to move the axle up past the lower truck support to gain access to the hex bolt with a allen socket wrench. You would understand once you jacked up you trike and see how the mounted the shock bolts. I replced both of my shocks with the legend suspension and the brackets earlier this year. I learned a few things what worked best will working on the floor.

 

[iaff84]

MAT,
On bracket install. Make sure you remove both stock brackets before you try to instal a new one.
Also I am a little lost on why you need an allen wrench to replace bracket. I use a 3/4 wrench to remove lower shock bolt. You do not need to remove bolt from shock, it hits the frame anyway even if you wanted to remove it.
Start the shock bolt into new bracket, turn in all the way, leaving it only finger tight, then start center flange bolt, then pivot off that bolt to get other two axle flange bolts started. This can all be done quicker than I can type this, I am slow at this typing.
I have installed 4 sets here plus R&R several times on my own trike, this all working off floor. When done, you will think, that was easy!
Good luck on mufflers, rear bolt is a pain!
Dennis

 

[trikermutha]

MAT,
On bracket install. Make sure you remove both stock brackets before you try to instal a new one.
Also I am a little lost on why you need an allen wrench to replace bracket. I use a 3/4 wrench to remove lower shock bolt. You do not need to remove bolt from shock, it hits the frame anyway even if you wanted to remove it.
Start the shock bolt into new bracket, turn in all the way, leaving it only finger tight, then start center flange bolt, then pivot off that bolt to get other two axle flange bolts started. This can all be done quicker than I can type this, I am slow at this typing.
I have installed 4 sets here plus R&R several times on my own trike, this all working off floor. When done, you will think, that was easy!
Good luck on mufflers, rear bolt is a pain!
Dennis

The shocks have allen type of bolts on the shocks does your bike have a hex head bolt on your shocks??

You can get the shock bolt out by used a bottle jack and move the axle up to remove and gain access to the head of the shock bolt. By moving the axle it moves it past the frame of the bike.

 

[iaff84]

I can not see end of bolt head but it feels like it does have an allen head in it. It also is a 3/4 inch hex head. As I never took it off, never saw the allen head part.

Total removal of bolt is not necessary for replacing brackets. I guess you did remove and replace the shocks with air system. Do you like the air ride system?
Dennis

 

[trikermutha]

I can not see end of bolt head but it feels like it does have an allen head in it. It also is a 3/4 inch hex head. As I never took it off, never saw the allen head part.

Total removal of bolt is not necessary for replacing brackets. I guess you did remove and replace the shocks with air system. Do you like the air ride system?
Dennis

yes I find that the ride is much better than stock and can be adjusted on the fly .
Nothing beats independent suspension ..

I didnt mount the compressor under the bike its in the rear lower trunk out of the way.

I am confused as how you loosened and tightened the shock bolt up with the new lift backet

 

[10rhrk]

Here's what your muffler mounting bracket's look like. I'm sure it's made this way for strength. This one came off the left side of my Road King when I went to 2into1 exhaust. I put the muffler's on the 2012 Triglide using a standard 1/2 inch open end box end wrench. The bolt's are 5/16 NC X 1/2
they have a lock washer on them that raises the bolt head where you can get a wrench on it. It's not easy, but can be done. You can see the rubber isolator the bracket slides back and forth in as the system heats and cools. Good luck!!

 

[M.A.T.]

Yes I should have said a offset box rachet wrench. the flex head is too straight or flat to get the tool past the muffler lip on the bracket it faces upward.

I think they have a 30 deg head on them at sears..

here is what they look like make sure you get the wrench that can be used on both sides of the wrench when inserting into a bolt or nut.

Sears: Online department store featuring appliances, tools, fitness equipment and more

trikermutha,
I am not sure I want to spend this much money for a set of wrenches. Sorry, I am not cheap but I have to draw the line. Do me a favor, check out this link:

Sears: Online department store featuring appliances, tools, fitness equipment and more

Use the zoom feature and take a close look at the mechanism on these wrenches. It protrudes a tiny bit and was wondering if this would be enough to grab the bolt and clear the lip on the bracket?

This might be just the ticket, unless I can find an open stock version single 1/2" of the set you bought.
Rob

 

[iaff84]

I am confused as how you loosened and tightened the shock bolt up with the new lift backet

I just tighten with a 3/4 inch wrench. Did not use torque wrench on them. When I checked lug nuts after a few hundred miles, slid under bike and checked lower shock bolt.
Stock brackets have a pressed in type fastener, when I make brackets, they have a more beefy 1/2 / 13 nut TIG ed on them, I was not worried about setting a specific torque to them.
For brackets, only tools I used were a long 3/4 wrench and 1/2 inch ratchet with a 9/16 inch socket. By taking off both stock brackets, axle was at full droop, in all cases I installed, no jacking of axle to align flange bolts was necessary. After installing bottom shock bolt and center flange bolt, I was able to pivot bracket by hand to get the other two started.
If there is a better and easier way to instal these, I am all ears. Will add to instal instructions.
Now I have also put a 1.5 inch set on mine, these I had to use a jack to assist. These were the only set of those I have made. I felt they were too much lift and 1 inch set I tried were not enough. The one inch set practically fell into place.
And that's my story
Dennis

 

[trikermutha]

trikermutha,
I am not sure I want to spend this much money for a set of wrenches. Sorry, I am not cheap but I have to draw the line. Do me a favor, check out this link:

Sears: Online department store featuring appliances, tools, fitness equipment and more

Use the zoom feature and take a close look at the mechanism on these wrenches. It protrudes a tiny bit and was wondering if this would be enough to grab the bolt and clear the lip on the bracket?

This might be just the ticket, unless I can find an open stock version single 1/2" of the set you bought.
Rob

looks like that may just work..But still I would recommend looking under your bike first before going to the store.

looks like the tool maybe just the ticket ...

 

[trikermutha]

I just tighten with a 3/4 inch wrench. Did not use torque wrench on them. When I checked lug nuts after a few hundred miles, slid under bike and checked lower shock bolt.
Stock brackets have a pressed in type fastener, when I make brackets, they have a more beefy 1/2 / 13 nut TIG ed on them, I was not worried about setting a specific torque to them.
For brackets, only tools I used were a long 3/4 wrench and 1/2 inch ratchet with a 9/16 inch socket. By taking off both stock brackets, axle was at full droop, in all cases I installed, no jacking of axle to align flange bolts was necessary. After installing bottom shock bolt and center flange bolt, I was able to pivot bracket by hand to get the other two started.
If there is a better and easier way to instal these, I am all ears. Will add to instal instructions.
Now I have also put a 1.5 inch set on mine, these I had to use a jack to assist. These were the only set of those I have made. I felt they were too much lift and 1 inch set I tried were not enough. The one inch set practically fell into place.
And that's my story
Dennis

man the plates on your bike were different than mine. the stock plate on mine had no pressed in fastener. anyway I also found the my Legend air suspension shocks are a bit longer than the stock shock when fully extended.

 

[iaff84]

man the plates on your bike were different than mine. the stock plate on mine had no pressed in fastener. anyway I also found the my Legend air suspension shocks are a bit longer than the stock shock when fully extended.

This shows stock bracket on top. Note the threaded portion, It was pressed in and not welded, or appears like that to me. This off an 11 TG.
Dennis

 

[trikermutha]

This shows stock bracket on top. Note the threaded portion, It was pressed in and not welded, or appears like that to me. This off an 11 TG.
Dennis

You are probably right..Its been a long year for me, since I put on the plates..And I cant find mine at the moment to look..To much crap laying around..I need to spend some time cleaning up the garage...Mine was off a 2010..

 

[iaff84]

Do not feel alone, I have two sets of them some where that I can not find, I just happened to have that picture on computer.
Dennis

 

[M.A.T.]

Hey 10rhrk,
Those photos were awesome, and just what I (this thread) needed. I sorta had an idea, but they were the icing on the cake.ThumbUp

looks like that may just work..But still I would recommend looking under your bike first before going to the store.

looks like the tool maybe just the ticket ...

trikermutha,
Unfortunately the store is 25 minutes before getting home, and would have been closed by the time I went back. I figure they have such a great return policy.........so..........


To All You Guys,
You have been the best, thank you so much!!!! You all deserve medals for putting up with my crap.

And as a result, not only do I have the confidence, I believe I have all the tools required as well. I have the flex head 1/2" ratcheting, the non-ratcheting offset 1/2", and the Gear Wrench version of the Sears 8-in-2 ratcheting wrenches (the Gear Wrench has a 5 degree swing and the Sears were much greater for the same price so I went with the Gear Wrench brand, same warr.). Whatever I don't use goes back.

I also bought red and the blue permatex liquid.

I really hope the Gear Wrench 8-in-2 works, but even if it doesn't I am going to keep them anyway to keep on the TG. It's a great way to have 8 sizes with only 2 wrenches.

They are calling for snow tomorrow so it's on baby, and I can take my time. I plan on getting a good nights rest, eating a decent breakfast, and hopefully can begin around noon. I plan on taking as many photos as possible along the way and even a video before and after to document the sound difference.

If I run into any trouble with the lift kit are you sure I can give you a call Dennis? I would appreciate it if so. And even after all this, don't be surprised if I do.

Anyway, I can't thank you guys enough. Honestly, you all helped make this happen.ThumbUp

Rob

 

[iaff84]

You have my cell number, you can call anytime.
Dennis

 

[M.A.T.]

Hey Man, THANKS! I might have to do that just to thank you personally.
Rob

 

[JohnC]

Well, how did the swap go, Rob? Did you run into any unforeseen problems? I'm looking forward to your full report.

 

[iaff84]

Well, how did the swap go, Rob? Did you run into any unforeseen problems? I'm looking forward to your full report.

What happened, hope your hand is not stuck around tight area at rear of muffler!!!! Or did the snow hit your area?
Dennis

 

[10rhrk]

His hands are probably all taped up from the cut's and scraps to where he can't type...lol

 

[iaff84]

His hands are probably all taped up from the cut's and scraps to where he can't type...lol

I think a lot of snow was dumped there??? Power outage also.

 

[M.A.T.]

It's nice to know I have friends like you guys that are willing to have fun at my expense, but who also worry about me and my well being ThumbUp !!!!

Ok, it's a Monday, I do my posts at work, I have a lot to say and show you, but in a nutshell,

:LooksGreat:

I need to reduce the size of the photographs I am going to upload to save room on the forum. I took over 60 pics, and two videos. It's all positive reviews on both the Lift Kit and the Mufflers. Please bear with me I want to do this right. I promise to post something later.

Rob

 

[M.A.T.]

Ok Gang, Here we go. The weather was perfect, rain changing slowing to snow, to all snow, no chance of getting a ride in today so break out the tools. Take a deep breath, IT'S GO TIME!

Did just as I said, prepped myself by sleeping in, eating breakfast and then lazing around until almost 10 am.

Took me about an hour to get all the tools and lights set up. Had everything laid out before beginning. Oh, and I did cheat a bit, I forgot to mention I have an air wrench, set at 50 ft/lbs. Not that it mattered, because I forgot the air fitting didn't work with my hoses and I had to switch it out twice, once to get it off my air inflation fitting and then back again, after I read the manual that you need to add 2- 3 lbs of air to the shocks before letting any out so as to not let oil escape. I'm a stickler for detail sometimes. Anyway.

So, first thing I do is make sure I am even able to lift the Trike up in the air sufficiently to remove the rear wheels. I positioned my bike jack just south of the tranny cover and just barely caught the rear frame tube on the right. But it was enough. I checked the lifting, up, up, up, rear is sagging pretty bad.

Down, down, down, Hmmmmm. Ok, still not centered, so I need to keep the front down so the rear will stay up. Remembered msocko3 used eye hooks and straps! So I sorta did the same thing without putting holes in the floor.

So I attached straps to the bike jack, and then to the floor board supports, knowing as I raised the bike the straps would have to ultimately keep the front down, and raise the rear. Worked like a charm. But I was a little afraid that now the front might get tipsy. And I knew I'd be under the rear, and cranking on those shock bracket flange bolts and shock bolts, so I added some support in the front and the rear, in the form of a jack stand under the frame up front and a old car jack from a 75' Eldorado, in the rear under the gear protection frame. I knew it would only be there to keep the Trike from teetering so I wasn't worried about damage. Now I felt like i could work under the Trike safely.

So I figured I better start with the Lift Kit. It went just as Dennis said it would. To add to the safety factor, I used a wrench and a rubber mallet to loosen the bolts, knowing there would be little downward or upward force this way. Once they were loose I brought in the air wrench and zipped them right out. The axle dropped, and I used blue permatex thread lock and applied it to all the bolts and started putting them back in. Now, had I listed to Dennis exactly, I would have taken both existing supports off before trying to put the new ones on, so once I took the other existing one off, the new one I had started and was having trouble with was a breeze, and I probably didn't need to even let the air out of the shocks. Lesson learned, listen to Dennis save 45 minutes at least.

Honestly though,, getting set up and putting the tools away takes longer than installing the lift kit. Anyone in Harford County, or close to me wants a hand and doesn't have the tools or a garage, let me know. I would be glad to help out.

Ok, so on to the mufflers. I figured this would be the easy part, thinking having every possible tool available would be just what the doctor ordered for those bolts. I get under, start with the forward bolt, using the gear wrench and it's a snap! Wow, this is too easy. I get all excited, move to the rear bolt and no go! Not even close. Can barely feel the head of the bolt. What gives?! then I see what the problem is. The black rubber hanger vibration isolator is not centered on the hanger bracket and is so close to the rear bolt it is impossible to get anything on it. But it's just rubber. I thought about using a knife and removing some of it. But it is soft enough that, if, I, try, real, hard [grunting sounds] I can, squeeze, a [still grunting, only now wincing too from jamming my hands up in this 3 cubic inch space] tiny 1/4" drive ratchet [Ahhhhhhh!!!] and VOILA! Just like Dennis (iaff84) said. The bolt comes right out. Of course the other side was worse but with some perseverance, the human mind will always win out over a stupid bolt. So the first order of business was to make sure those darn rubber vibration isolators were as centered as possible. Once I did that, Installing both front and back bolts were as easy as pie with that little 1/4" ratchet. Now I re-used the factory muffler clamps, simply because I liked how stout the design and hardware was compared to the aftermarket clamp design and hardware. The left side went on so easy, the right side almost did me in. But again, I didn't give up and finally won [hear Rocky theme music in background].

So there I was looking down at a - "DON'T FORGET TO PUT AIR BACK IN SHOCKS!!!" - was what my wife said as I attempted to start it up and sit on it ( I was so excited, was my excuse ).

Anyway, it looked B.A., and although it didn't sound too B.A. at first after a 60 mile ride the next day it came around nicely. I think it needs to break in some more, and expect it to get louder and snappier sounding. The lift kit made a world of difference. I don't want to promote any unsafe riding habits but I could tell I could take sharper curves at higher speeds than before. And just the overall feel was nicer, more stable. I felt less bogged down in the rear around turns. I am running 40 psi in the shocks so that might have something to do with it too. All I can say is I am no expert and I can notice a huge difference in the way it rides. I know the 1.5" increase in height will come in handy loading and unloading the Trike in and out of my trailer. Especially now with the end caps I bought. Oh, and I tell ya, there are actually two dimensions to consider, the body height, and the muffler bottom height. Since these mufflers are 3.5" diameter and I raised the body 1.5" it's like the mufflers are now 2" higher off the ground. That's a huge improvement over stock. Something to consider if you do a lot of field meet or camp ground driving and the ground is really uneven, or rutted.

So for the sake of saving time, here is a link to some fo the photos I took, and the the two videos. I hope this works for you guys but if not, PM me and I will send it to you in an e-mail. If I knew how to post thumbnails that link you to them I would.........

http://www.triketalk.com/forum/memb...ft-kit-supertrapp-kerker-muffler-install.html

Let me know what you think. Thanks to all of you this was possible!!!

Rob

 

[M.A.T.]

Oh, I'm keeping those Gear Wrench 8 in 2 ratcheting wrenches, and returning the rest though. They are really nice and will stay on the bike as part of my on-board tools. $30 bucks at Sears. Get you sum!
Rob