Advice on goldwing clutch master cylinder needed

[triwinggirl]

hi everyone;

I ran into something totally unexpected. we started by bleeding the clutch, when I opened the master cylinder it had no actual fluid in it. the clutch worked before disassembly.

when I opened it, it was full of sludge, guu, general nasty stuff, but no actual fluid. I cleaned out the master cylinder and tried to bleed it, nothing would pull through. while we had clean fluid in it, it kept burping sludge into the clean fluid when we pulled the lever but would not push anything through the line. after disconnecting the lower connection at the slave fluid came out of the line but the lever would not push anything through the line still.

im hoping I can clear the line with air and brake cleaner. im going to disassemble the master cylinder, but expect to have to rebuild it.

im concerned that the slave needs replacing but im not sure. I don't know if its cleanable. I also don't know if the slave has an issue. I was able to suck fluid out of the slave no real sludgy just old fluid.

im also concerned that the front brake master needs rebuilding as well. did not have time to open it today so I don't know what condition its in. I replaced the front brake fluid at least once and good fluid came out of most front brake lines.

what I want to know is what would some of you do. would you clean or replace the clogged line. would you rebuild both masters. would you replace the slave or clean it, I need to order parts by Monday.

we are also chasing leaks in the rear lines. it does not seem to be the new lines that are leaking. it seems to be other connections that are loose so far I fixed 2 and it still pushing fluid into the system by the pedal, so more leaks. fortunately not many places left to tighten. I think I know which ones.

 

[trike lady]

Hello

You can purchase a slave cylinder rebuild kit. The fluid from the clutch master cylinder has leaked into the engine and the oil and filter will have to be changed. You may want to rebuild the clutch master cylinder and make sure the return orifice is open also. Compressed air should free the line of an obstruction.

 

[triwinggirl]

Hello

You can purchase a slave cylinder rebuild kit. The fluid from the clutch master cylinder has leaked into the engine and the oil and filter will have to be changed. You may want to rebuild the clutch master cylinder and make sure the return orifice is open also. Compressed air should free the line of an obstruction.

thank you I had not considered the slave leaking. I guess if the master is that bad the slave would be to. so lets see. $82 for the slave it comes complete all new all parts, $12 for front brake master rebuild, $23 for the clutch master rebuild, oh yea and $90+ for motor oil and filter. I hope this is the last my credit card is melting.:gah:

at least it will be all new when im done. the rear master was replaced a couple years ago on recall, so it already new.

 

[trike lady]

You're welcome.

Whenever you find the reservoir empty the fluid has gone into the engine. It happens on GL1200, GL1500 and GL1800 models as they all have hydraulic clutches. It can get expensive when bikes and trikes sit, especially with carbs on older Wings.

 

[triwinggirl]

LOL

we have decided that with all the money and new parts spent on JOY. JOY needs to buy her own gasoline for awhile.

 

[Gorilla]

we have decided that with all the money and new parts spent on JOY. JOY needs to buy her own gasoline for awhile.

Don't you wish that was possible!

 

[triwinggirl]

I got everything off the master cylinder is fine and rebuildable. im replacing the clutch line.

the slave cylinder is reusable but it has a glaze inside of it. I could not find a hone that size, I think a hone would take to much metal anyway. so im looking for other ways to clean the inside of the slave cylinder.

things already suggested are very fine sand paper, again I think this would take to much metal. toothpaste, ketchup. has anyone used these do they work. do you have another suggestion.

brake cleaner kinda gave its all.:xzqxz:

 

[triwinggirl]

the winner is

a green scrubby and dawn dish soap.

 

[Jack Klarich]

Use caution honing aluminum cylinders

If they are scored or rusted bad, replace them

The aluminum is pretty unforgiving when honing most of the time

Some have an anodized coating, once it is scored the pitting will continue making sealing questionable

Try cleaning with a soft lint free cloth and clean brake fluid

Use lots of assembly fluid or clean brake fluid to reassemble

 

[triwinggirl]

I think it will be fine, it clean and very smooth inside and has very light scratches on it from the scrubby. I will lube it up good.

 

[triwinggirl]

confused

now im really confused, I have taken the clutch master cylinder apart now the third time. it is clean the inside rebuild parts are all new. the master resivoir will move fluid out of it through the holes. it will not pump fluid through to the clutch line. we even loosened the line at the master to get flow. the only thing I can think of is the master cylinder it's self needs replacing.

everything else is new.

any advice here would help.

 

[Jack Klarich]

now im really confused, I have taken the clutch master cylinder apart now the third time. it is clean the inside rebuild parts are all new. the master resivoir will move fluid out of it through the holes. it will not pump fluid through to the clutch line. we even loosened the line at the master to get flow. the only thing I can think of is the master cylinder it's self needs replacing.

everything else is new.

any advice here would help.

Look inside the master

As you stroke the lever you should see the compensate r port in the bottom of the resivour open and close

If not the master is probably by passing internally

Replace the master

 

[triwinggirl]

Look inside the master

As you stroke the lever you should see the compensate r port in the bottom of the resivour open and close

If not the master is probably by passing internally

Replace the master

Question would that cause fluid to come out the smaller hole when pulling the lever? I have checked everything 3 times now, I think its bypassing internally it seems like the plunger cup on the piston is just not sealing. everything else indicates it should be working.

 

[Sidecarbill]

Fluid thats shoots up like a geyser from the relief port when you pull the lever usually means its bypassing. I'm not familiar with your setup is it possible you put the cup in backwards?

 

[triwinggirl]

before we ever pulled it to rebuild it when we pulled the lever fluid did squirt out of the relief port. like I have been saying it wont pump at all, it seems the consensus is replace the whole thing.:xzqxz:

I want to take this opportunity to thank everyone for working with me on my word issues and my descriptions of things I cant remember the names of, it's a head injury thing so

THANK YOU ALL :clapping:

 

[Jack Klarich]

The fluid should not squirt up, it should open and close easy, the fluid drops down inside the piston bore building pressure between the rubber cups

If a cup were backwards it could do this, tho on assembly it would NOT look right PLUS it may have turned or rolled over inside the bore

This would also cause a loss of pressure seen as a by pass

If you can afford it I would just replace it

IMO most modern day masters are not worth the effort to rebuild any more

Good luck with your project As a side note, buy only the amount of brake fluid you need

Once opened the clock starts ticking on brake fluid

Being a hygroscopic fluid it begins taking on moisture at a rapid rate

I trash fluid that has been opened and un used for more than a month Not worth my safety or my customers

 

[triwinggirl]

im sure everything is in right. so it seems its bypassing. I guess im buying a new clutch master cylinder. I will heed that fluid warning. I guess its time I tried the brake side.

 

[Jack Klarich]

im sure everything is in right. so it seems its bypassing. I guess im buying a new clutch master cylinder. I will heed that fluid warning. I guess its time I tried the brake side.

A tried and trued way to bleed brakes, pump them up ( go slow and medium strokes ) don't bottom the lever out

After a few pumps, strap the pedal or lever depending on front or rear brakes

Now, after securing it take a break for a few hours, over night wont hurt

Next, un do the strap and bleed the wheels as normal

You should now have a firm brake

 

[triwinggirl]

these are all new empty lines, the front brakes are dry, the clutch is dry, all new parts and lines. do I do this before using the bleeder. I got an air type bleeder that sucks though the system from the bleeder valve. not worried about the back it still pumping and was not fully drained just the front lines would the pump up procedure apply to them?

I have bleed manually before and changed fluid once. this is my first time dry and my first time with master cylinders I am VERY GRATEFUL for the help. THANK YOU

 

[Jack Klarich]

these are all new empty lines, the front brakes are dry, the clutch is dry, all new parts and lines. do I do this before using the bleeder. I got an air type bleeder that sucks though the system from the bleeder valve. not worried about the back it still pumping and was not fully drained just the front lines would the pump up procedure apply to them?

Fill all the master cylinders up, tap on the body of the master with the cap off, do you see bubbles?

If you do continue until the bubbles slow down or stop

This has worked some of the trapped air out of the cylinder bore

Remember if u pump the brakes go slow and use medium strokes

Fast and long strokes will agitate the fluid causing more air bubbles

If you have a bleeder use it it is way better than pumping and will get more air out faster

Patience is a virtue when it comes to bleeding hydraulics

I am confident u came this far NOT to be whooped Good Luck, we are on your team

This goes the same for the clutch

You would think smaller lines less to fill and bleed

Nah, hydraulics are a funny animal, kind of reminds me of lectrical problems

Ya got to start at the source and work out from there

The source here is the master cylinder

Some times gravity is your best friend when bleeding

However the comp port needs to be working, that is why I like to slow pump then strap the lever to the bars, wait a good long time, release the strap bleed em then go for a ride

 

[triwinggirl]

THANK YOU

I really believed the rebuilt master should have functioned. I did not see any reason why it would not. ive been having the same no pressure problem with the front brake and there is no reason why it would not work except it's dry too.

it's currently off the bike and in the house I put it together and put water in the resivore then tapped out the bubble as instructed to do. suddenly while holding my finger over the line hole water was squirting from under my finger and there was suction on releasing the lever. so I do believe im going to put it back on, get the bubbles out pump it up and bleed it just to see that it will work before I order a new one.

I got to reading my service manual a little more indepth, it says to pump the lever while bleeding with a bleeder until fluid comes out with out bubbles. I had a feeling on that one.

yes I took it apart and dried all the water out, I will reassemble in morning.:xzqxz:

it's seems I have learned a step I was not aware of. the piston cylinder must have fluid in it to flow. I must get the air out or nothing will flow.

thank you sir you may have saved me a lot of money I may not have to spend right now.:clapping:

 

[Gold Rush]

Just a suggestion... You might fill that brake reservoir with actual brake fluid and flush that water out completely. You DO NOT want any moisture in your brake system. :xszpv: :xszpv:

Glad you are on the road to being on the road!!

 

[Jack Klarich]

I really believed the rebuilt master should have functioned. I did not see any reason why it would not. ive been having the same no pressure problem with the front brake and there is no reason why it would not work except it's dry too.

it's currently off the bike and in the house I put it together and put water in the resivore then tapped out the bubble as instructed to do. suddenly while holding my finger over the line hole water was squirting from under my finger and there was suction on releasing the lever. so I do believe im going to put it back on, get the bubbles out pump it up and bleed it just to see that it will work before I order a new one.

I got to reading my service manual a little more indepth, it says to pump the lever while bleeding with a bleeder until fluid comes out with out bubbles. I had a feeling on that one.

yes I took it apart and dried all the water out, I will reassemble in morning.:xzqxz:

it's seems I have learned a step I was not aware of. the piston cylinder must have fluid in it to flow. I must get the air out or nothing will flow.

thank you sir you may have saved me a lot of money I may not have to spend right now.:clapping:

Just a suggestion... You might fill that brake reservoir with actual brake fluid and flush that water out completely. You DO NOT want any moisture in your brake system. :xszpv: :xszpv:

Glad you are on the road to being on the road!!

# 2 on the moisture

Before you put the master back on,

clamp it in a vise

Fill the resivour , stroke the cylinder slowly, cover the brake line hole on the return stroke til straight fluid come out This is called bench bleeding

It will remove the trapped air in the master cylinder bore

You should have pressure thru the line when you install it now

 

[triwinggirl]

i got it i think for now

im sure its dry inside I took it apart last night a dried all the parts, it laid on my table all night open.

like I said I intent to proceed as told. 1 tap out air in the pump, 2 pump up the cylinder, 3 strap down the lever, then bleed the line with my bleed while slowly pumping the lever until fluid flow clear with no bubbles out the bleeder 4 tighten the bleeder and try the clutch.

I thank you for helping me with procedures. my friends wont correct me or tell me how to do something im having trouble with. im grateful for those here that will help a broken lady remember and relearn when needed.

hoping the next post says yeeee haaaa they work.

 

[triwinggirl]

good and bad and good news

I GOT FRONT BRAKES YYYEEEE HHHAAAA

the front brakes bled fast the lever firmed up nice. the clutch took longer and did not seem to want to pressurize.

im going to replace both the clutch slave and clutch master. this issue should be fixed then. somewhere it was bleeding pressure and sucking air. I assume it was sucking at the slave and bleeding pressure at the master. I gave it a good try to fix parts I hoped were repairable.

the new clutch line is in place, neither the slave or master replacement will prevent me putting the body on, well most of it anyway except a couple front pieces.

we are doing the rear brakes tomorrow. don't expect any un repairable leaks.

thank you for the help here I do now know how and have bled lines with my bleeder.

this is it for this thread no more reason to continue here. please continue to follow my other thread for continued progress that will go quick now.

 

[LadyonaMission]

 

[Jack Klarich]

:clapping: