Wrap Head Pipes?

[psychogramps]

I de-catted both of my TG's. Now on my Free I'm thinking of wrapping with titanium wrap. Any thoughts what would reduce heat better? Willie

 

[FLTR2008TRIKE]

Ceramic coaat the head pipe both inside and outside

 

[DTR 11TG]

Ceramic coaat the head pipe both inside and outside

did you do this to your pipes, did you do it yourself or have it done? Thanks for any help, I have been thinking of the titanium wrap or the ceramic coating.:wave4:

 

[FLTR2008TRIKE]

I have not done it yet. When I do a engine overhaul I will.

The aadvantage to having it both coated inside and out is the ceramic coating helps keep the heat inside the pipe and lowers the outside heat radiating from it.

The wrap wont give you the same heat reduction.

 

[DTR 11TG]

I have not done it yet. When I do a engine overhaul I will.

The aadvantage to having it both coated inside and out is the ceramic coating helps keep the heat inside the pipe and lowers the outside heat radiating from it.

The wrap wont give you the same heat reduction.

Thanks for the info ThumbUp

 

[Springman2007]

Cearamic Coating

I have a 2015 Freewheeler. I purchased a "decated" head pipe for my FLRT on ebay. I then mounted two of the large O2 sensor bungs up near the head inlets - I have adaptors to allow for the smaller stock O2 sensors to be mounted to those bungs. I then sent the modified headpipe down to a place in Columbus, Ohio to have it ceramic coated inside and out in 2000 degree black.

The whole endeavor cost me approximately $243.00 and I have yet to install it - its on my list of things to get done this spring.

If you are wondering about the second set of bungs...well, I have read and been told that sometimes the stock placement of the O2 sensors on a "decated" headpipe can "cross-talk" and that will effect performance. So, being able to relocate them up the header pipes can eliminate that, if it happens. I decided to have them setup for the larger O2 sensors and use adapters because it means my headpipe can now mount either and is open for use with virtually all of the tuner systems out there.......

Springman

 

[Sloufoot]

I have a 2015 Freewheeler. I purchased a "decated" head pipe for my FLRT on ebay. I then mounted two of the large O2 sensor bungs up near the head inlets - I have adaptors to allow for the smaller stock O2 sensors to be mounted to those bungs. I then sent the modified headpipe down to a place in Columbus, Ohio to have it ceramic coated inside and out in 2000 degree black.

The whole endeavor cost me approximately $243.00 and I have yet to install it - its on my list of things to get done this spring.

If you are wondering about the second set of bungs...well, I have read and been told that sometimes the stock placement of the O2 sensors on a "decated" headpipe can "cross-talk" and that will effect performance. So, being able to relocate them up the header pipes can eliminate that, if it happens. I decided to have them setup for the larger O2 sensors and use adapters because it means my headpipe can now mount either and is open for use with virtually all of the tuner systems out there.......

Springman

I wouldn't worry about the "crosstalk" . What you should be looking at is the depth of the sensor in the pipe. They have a hard enough time being as short as they are being in the main exhaust flow. If you put in an adapter, it will move the sensor tip almost out of the pipe.
With a free flowing exhaust the gasses have a much less dwell time in the sensor area. Unless you have some way to read the O2's to see them working correctly.( can only be verified with a sniffer gas detector while reading the ECM result)
I really don't think you have one of those......

 

[msocko3]

I have a 2015 Freewheeler. I purchased a "decated" head pipe for my FLRT on ebay. I then mounted two of the large O2 sensor bungs up near the head inlets - I have adaptors to allow for the smaller stock O2 sensors to be mounted to those bungs. I then sent the modified headpipe down to a place in Columbus, Ohio to have it ceramic coated inside and out in 2000 degree black.

The whole endeavor cost me approximately $243.00 and I have yet to install it - its on my list of things to get done this spring.

If you are wondering about the second set of bungs...well, I have read and been told that sometimes the stock placement of the O2 sensors on a "decated" headpipe can "cross-talk" and that will effect performance. So, being able to relocate them up the header pipes can eliminate that, if it happens. I decided to have them setup for the larger O2 sensors and use adapters because it means my headpipe can now mount either and is open for use with virtually all of the tuner systems out there.......

Springman

As Sloufoot said depth is an issue, plus I also wouldn't worry about cross talk as its been proven not to be much of an issue. The problem you will have is your O2 sensor wire for the front will not be long enough, and the 12mm heated O2 sensors Harley is using in the 2010 and later touring won't last real long exposed to that much heat. The sensors are going to take more abuse that close to the exhaust port than they were designed for, keep some spares handy as your going to need them.

 

[Springman2007]

I wouldn't worry about the "crosstalk" . What you should be looking at is the depth of the sensor in the pipe. They have a hard enough time being as short as they are being in the main exhaust flow. If you put in an adapter, it will move the sensor tip almost out of the pipe.
With a free flowing exhaust the gasses have a much less dwell time in the sensor area. Unless you have some way to read the O2's to see them working correctly.( can only be verified with a sniffer gas detector while reading the ECM result)
I really don't think you have one of those......

Depth of emersion is within 0.119" of stock........
And, 0.107" to 0.110" of the two upper pipes centerline....

I did think about that and tested the placement before and after fabrication.

Springman

- - - Updated - - -

As Sloufoot said depth is an issue, plus I also wouldn't worry about cross talk as its been proven not to be much of an issue. The problem you will have is your O2 sensor wire for the front will not be long enough, and the 12mm heated O2 sensors Harley is using in the 2010 and later touring won't last real long exposed to that much heat. The sensors are going to take more abuse that close to the exhaust port than they were designed for, keep some spares handy as your going to need them.

I guess we will see........but, I sort of doubt it.....

Springman

 

[Springman2007]

A final note on my modified Headpipe:

with the installation of the second set of bungs, I can now easily mount 18mm wide band O2 sensors as used by some of the Pro Tuner systems out there. I was looking at the ProVision with the Autotune Pro add-on....

I know the ThunderMax system uses 18mm, wide band O2 sensors as well - Wonder if that could work on my Freewheeler now?

I can't say I know of any systems using a wide-band 12mm O2 sensor to date.... (I am sure there can/will be)

Its nice having choices now.....

Springman

 

[msocko3]

I guess we will see........but, I sort of doubt it.....

Springman

You'll have to let us know how it works out for you, your a pioneer, I haven't seen anyone else put them up into the mouth or the dragon.

 

[Springman2007]

You'll have to let us know how it works out for you, your a pioneer, I haven't seen anyone else put them up into the mouth or the dragon.

Well, actually, I have seen it done on a few street/race bikes. I will keep you posted though.

I was more interested in performance comparison of relocating the stock O2 sensors on a "decatted" headpipe when I did it though.

For now, my plan is to go with a Harley Tuner and have the folks tuning it do the comparison on the O2 positions. I talked to them about it initially as they were the ones that let me know about the possible "crosstalk" occurances initially. I have to say that all the other, O2 equipped bikes I ever owned, had the sensors toward the heads, so it never came up before.

I have to say that even if I do find that keeping the O2 sensors in the stock local is not an issue of any kind, I am not sorry for the time and money in the modification. As I said, it lets me have options and I would not have to tear into that part of the bike again to utilize those options.

I also like to say, I am becoming very interested in the ProVision Tuner, and as I said, their AutoTune Pro add-on uses 18mm wide-band sensors as I understand - now, I do know of some shops (Tuners) that use it and say its better that the standard setup in that it can be removed when the final "Tune" is achieve and that means that the shop can use theirs and then remove it - you would still have to buy a basic Provision system, just not the AutoTune Pro add-on.

So, it may not be a modification for everyone; but, it is a modification for everyone to know and understand exists.

Springman