What's the difference and why?

[GoSlo]

I've bought new exhaust, AC, and tuner for my 2013 TriGlide, but am kind of confused on the header choice. I can get a takeoff header from another TriGlide for free so I can keep my stock one with the cat in either way I go.

So my options are to cut the cat out or buy a new header. Is there an advantage/disadvantage to either choice other than cost? I read something somewhere about the new headers have a better chamber, but I don't even know what that's referring to.

Thanks!

 

[americanbadass]

There have been many threads about this subject....get a header system, and eliminate the cat. They say a dedicated header system is more efficient and will add some horsies. I'll bet if you research the forum, you could find much discussion on this subject.
Cutting the cat out would also be a real pain in the a$$ IMO.

 

[Shriner Jim]

I took off the original head pipes and bought a used headpipe that had the cat already removed. I have these connected to Cobra Tri-Ovals. They sound good, at least I like them. The best sounding mufflers I ever had were Vance & Hines Monster Ovals. They went away when I traded.

 

[Phu Cat]

Last summer when I was wondering about knocking the cat out of our TG, I checked on the price of a new head pipe in case the gov't ever got stupid enough to stat checking bike exhausts. The $787 cost of a new header convinced me to buy an aftermarket header pipes and keep my old ones just in case.

I've wondered if stock head pipes would produce less power than matching head pipe and muffler. Since the new head pipes have to fit in the same space as the old ones and are the same diameter, I can't imagine that set up producing any more power.

Everybody claims their product will produce more power. How many actually do?

PC

 

[rhino 2]

I've bought new exhaust, AC, and tuner for my 2013 TriGlide, but am kind of confused on the header choice. I can get a takeoff header from another TriGlide for free so I can keep my stock one with the cat in either way I go.

So my options are to cut the cat out or buy a new header. Is there an advantage/disadvantage to either choice other than cost? I read something somewhere about the new headers have a better chamber, but I don't even know what that's referring to.

Thanks!

After the stage 1, the best improvement overall was [for me] to 86 the Cat, That eliminated the heat issue. I would recommend however you do it take it out.ThumbUp

 

[GoSlo]

I'm definitely getting rid of the cat, I just want to know which way is better...cutting the cat out or buying new catless headers (Fullsac X-Pipe). If one way is definitely better than the other, I'd just like to know why.

Thanks for all the responses so far.

 

[trikermutha]

I'm definitely getting rid of the cat, I just want to know which way is better...cutting the cat out or buying new catless headers (Fullsac X-Pipe). If one way is definitely better than the other, I'd just like to know why.

Thanks for all the responses so far.

check ebay there are sellers cutting out the cat and selling them cheaper

 

[screwball]

We have 2 Harley trikes, an 09 and 11. Both have stock headers with the cats still intact. In my younger years I'd spend a couple of grand for that extra horsepower or 2, just doesn't make sense on a 700lb trike, to me anyway. Personally I can't see how removing the cat does anything to remove heat. The cat is under your right foot, most of the heat issues are on the right calf. Exhaust gas is 1800*, cat or no cat. Removing the cat will remove some restriction, but even if it drops the temp 800* which it won't you still have 1000* at your calf. Want to stop the heat on your right leg?? MOVE YOUR LEG. I installed footboard re-locators, and a longer break pedal. Moved my let out and forward, neither wife or I have any heat issues with either bike. If you read a lot, you will find threads here and on the other board where people have dropped thousands for the 'heat issue' or the 'power issue'. After adding a tuner comes the complaints of poor fuel mileage. Take out the cat, less restriction, leaner burn, more heat. Add a tuner to richen up the mixture, down goes mileage. Smaller baffles, more restriction, richer mixture, why remove the cat?? Louder doesn't equate to faster.

Good Luck with your new scoot. Think of all the great places you can see, motels you can rent and fun you could have with the money you will spend to make your trike the "the leader of the pack " Remember, unless you are a real good mechanic and have lots of time and tools, it will cost you $80.00 an hour for a mechanic to bolt the stuff on your bike.

 

[GoSlo]

We have 2 Harley trikes, an 09 and 11. Both have stock headers with the cats still intact. In my younger years I'd spend a couple of grand for that extra horsepower or 2, just doesn't make sense on a 700lb trike, to me anyway. Personally I can't see how removing the cat does anything to remove heat. The cat is under your right foot, most of the heat issues are on the right calf. Exhaust gas is 1800*, cat or no cat. Removing the cat will remove some restriction, but even if it drops the temp 800* which it won't you still have 1000* at your calf. Want to stop the heat on your right leg?? MOVE YOUR LEG. I installed footboard re-locators, and a longer break pedal. Moved my let out and forward, neither wife or I have any heat issues with either bike. If you read a lot, you will find threads here and on the other board where people have dropped thousands for the 'heat issue' or the 'power issue'. After adding a tuner comes the complaints of poor fuel mileage. Take out the cat, less restriction, leaner burn, more heat. Add a tuner to richen up the mixture, down goes mileage. Smaller baffles, more restriction, richer mixture, why remove the cat?? Louder doesn't equate to faster.

Good Luck with your new scoot. Think of all the great places you can see, motels you can rent and fun you could have with the money you will spend to make your trike the "the leader of the pack " Remember, unless you are a real good mechanic and have lots of time and tools, it will cost you $80.00 an hour for a mechanic to bolt the stuff on your bike.

Thanks for the reply, but I'm still not getting the answer to my question.

As for your comments, the trike weighs about 1,200 pounds not 700. If you have the same power and components of a two wheeler it seems to me that you need to do something to move that additional 300+ pounds.

I've read many, many of your responses to people and how well your trikes run. I'm happy for you, I really am that yours run so well without doing much. But I've made my decision on what I want to do to mine and really wasn't asking for anyone's blessing or approval on what I'm planning. I am simply trying to find out what difference there is between a header that's had the cat removed and buying a new header without the cat.

Thanks again for all that have responded so far.

 

[rhino 2]

I'm definitely getting rid of the cat, I just want to know which way is better...cutting the cat out or buying new catless headers (Fullsac X-Pipe). If one way is definitely better than the other, I'd just like to know why.

Thanks for all the responses so far.

I took the whole system out , And Added the Stage 1 Rush true duals, and rush slip ons with 1.75 baffles, I didn't do it for performance, Those days are over for me.
As far gas mileage gos, I don't drive fast , And i don't drive slow, I just drive.
My mpg are; Around town 33, High way 38+.
P/S I saved the whole system and have it in my Barn, Just in case i want to go back to stock.

 

[lboos]

Just curious, does Harley Davidson approve of all these after market mod's ?
esp. as far as the warranty goes on a new motorcycle ? :Shrug:.

Just seems like after 110 years exp. of making motorcycles and all the engineers Harley has working for them, They would know what is best :Trike1:.

sometimes when I read about all these after market mod's [and their are many] I think about the progressive motorcycle insur. TV commercial where the guy on a motorcycle is covered with dollar bills, and as he rides, the dollar bills fly off of him [mod's].

What I would really like to see is a stock Harley and a like Harley with all the engine mod's you can get side by side to see the diff. in performance , and the money spent on the mod's. I think a lot of folks would be disappointed. Just my opinion .

 

[Sloufoot]

You might see around 2-5 hp more with the custom header. I can't see where that is worth the money as compared to just cutting out the cat. People on the forum have found that to cut a window in the collector and cleaning out the cat seems to be the easy way to do it, then get the window tig welded shut.
If you are looking on the net you can find a 2009 header that didn't have a cat. But if you already have access to an extra, I would go that way, & like you say, keep yours safely tucked away. That is what I did also.
I can't see the extra money for the header.
I also wrapped mine & got rid of a lot more heat by the way.

 

[msocko3]

Thanks for the reply, but I'm still not getting the answer to my question.

As for your comments, the trike weighs about 1,200 pounds not 700. If you have the same power and components of a two wheeler it seems to me that you need to do something to move that additional 300+ pounds.

I've read many, many of your responses to people and how well your trikes run. I'm happy for you, I really am that yours run so well without doing much. But I've made my decision on what I want to do to mine and really wasn't asking for anyone's blessing or approval on what I'm planning. I am simply trying to find out what difference there is between a header that's had the cat removed and buying a new header without the cat.

Thanks again for all that have responded so far.

I'll dispell a couple myths. The torque difference between a gutted stock head pipe vs either the X pipe or Jackpot will only be a handfull, you'll need a dyno to see it because you won't feel it. The average exhaust gas temp of a properly tuned gasoline engine will be around 1,400 - 1,500 degrees 3" from the exhaust port, if you see 1,600 somethings cooking and it sure aint your dinner. A tuner only kills fuel mileage when the person using it doesn't understand how to properly tune an engine. The fuel mileage on the 2010 Triglide I used to own got better by about 5+ mpg, and this was also with the installation of cams which increased my HP and Torque.

What people don't think about is a more efficient operating engine will produce more power and return good fuel mileage. The 120" engine in my 2006 Ultra Classic gets 41 mpg, there are bone stock brand new Harley's with 103" engines that can't get that kind of mileage.

Warranty, its true you mess with it your taking your warranty status in your own hands. Some dealers are real good about modifications and warranty and then there are some real dorks out there who will run and tell mommy you modified your new toy, the end result will be a flag on your warranty.

 

[GoSlo]

First off, thanks to Sloufoot and Msocko3 for finally answering my question.

For me, getting rid of the cat was going to be done one way or the other. I finally decided to go with the Sportpipe from Fullsac. I was told the difference between the X-Pipe and Sportpipe was the X-Pipe can be taken further than a Stage I upgrade and since I won't be going past that point, figured I'd save $120. I looked at headers on-line that had the cat taken out, but I don't know enough to feel confident that someone did a good job. Again, this was a decision best for me, plus I still have my stock header with the cat in if ever needed. Once everything is on, I'm getting it dyno'd so hopefully I'll see all the benefits...cooler, more efficient, more torque, and better gas mileage,. Will it be a "screamin azz hauler"? Probably not, but that's not what I'm looking for.

Final components being added: Stage I AC, SE Street Cannon mufflers, Fullsac Sportpipe headers, and SEPRO tuner dyno'd. I just don't have the interest or desire to tweak, play, adjust, etc. the tuner like many of you do).

As for the warranty, well my dealership will still honor it, but I guess we'll see what happens out on the road if anything ever happens.

Thanks to everyone again.

 

[Sloufoot]

First off, thanks to Sloufoot and Msocko3 for finally answering my question.

For me, getting rid of the cat was going to be done one way or the other. I finally decided to go with the Sportpipe from Fullsac. I was told the difference between the X-Pipe and Sportpipe was the X-Pipe can be taken further than a Stage I upgrade and since I won't be going past that point, figured I'd save $120. I looked at headers on-line that had the cat taken out, but I don't know enough to feel confident that someone did a good job. Again, this was a decision best for me, plus I still have my stock header with the cat in if ever needed. Once everything is on, I'm getting it dyno'd so hopefully I'll see all the benefits...cooler, more efficient, more torque, and better gas mileage,. Will it be a "screamin azz hauler"? Probably not, but that's not what I'm looking for.

Final components being added: Stage I AC, SE Street Cannon mufflers, Fullsac Sportpipe headers, and SEPRO tuner dyno'd. I just don't have the interest or desire to tweak, play, adjust, etc. the tuner like many of you do).

As for the warranty, well my dealership will still honor it, but I guess we'll see what happens out on the road if anything ever happens.

Thanks to everyone again.

If you are doing a stage 1 upgrade along with the pipe, if you are also doing the mufflers, make sure they do a good run on the dyno to make sure the engine doesn't have a lean problem.
Ride safe
Ride often
:Trike1:

 

[FRR]

Thanks for the reply, but I'm still not getting the answer to my question.

As for your comments, the trike weighs about 1,200 pounds not 700. If you have the same power and components of a two wheeler it seems to me that you need to do something to move that additional 300+ pounds.

I've read many, many of your responses to people and how well your trikes run. I'm happy for you, I really am that yours run so well without doing much. But I've made my decision on what I want to do to mine and really wasn't asking for anyone's blessing or approval on what I'm planning. I am simply trying to find out what difference there is between a header that's had the cat removed and buying a new header without the cat.

Thanks again for all that have responded so far.

Good point Goslo. Advice like "move your leg" is much like what my brother in law was told by a tech at Harley HQ when he complained about the heat. The tech said, " well, just ride it at night". My brother in law told him he didn't spend 32 K just to have a trike that he could only ride a night.

 

[jcolson]

Hey GoSLO, when they built my engine they told me anything SE would be covered. But when my rear lifter took a dump, it took out the cam & oil pump. HD said they would cover the cam.After bitching about it the dealer paid for it. When I was out in Denver last year I was having another problem with it using oil & alot of noise. They said at Fort Collins HD shop that it wouldn't be covered by the warranty. You look in the HD parst book it says SE parst are covered. So what gives. They are feeding us a line of Bullsh--t. You are screwed out on the road. Good luck!! Jim

 

[msocko3]

Hey GoSLO, when they built my engine they told me anything SE would be covered. But when my rear lifter took a dump, it took out the cam & oil pump. HD said they would cover the cam.After bitching about it the dealer paid for it. When I was out in Denver last year I was having another problem with it using oil & alot of noise. They said at Fort Collins HD shop that it wouldn't be covered by the warranty. You look in the HD parst book it says SE parst are covered. So what gives. They are feeding us a line of Bullsh--t. You are screwed out on the road. Good luck!! Jim

Warranty is a mixed bag, some dealers will look the other way and help out. Then there are dealers who have service managers that live to drop a dime on your modifications because they don't have any talent turning the wrenches. A good shop mechanic is dying breed, a lot of shops have parts changers.

 

[jcolson]

Your right on the money Mike. Most dealers won't pay enough to get a Master Mechanic. I found that out at the dealer I got mine at. Was told that from the horses mouth. No wonder people have so much trouble with there bikes not getting fixed right. Jim