Update for my oil leaking M8

[Steve on 3]

I got a call from the dealer this morning. They rode the bike and found that I do have an oil leak (duh) . It appeared to be coming through the breather. They tested it without the breather and found no leak, with the breather there is a leak. They theorize that something was left out of the head, possibly an o ring or a seal. The Moco has a guy onsite this morning to begin tearing the engine down or at least the upper ends. So far , they are full steam ahead on a fix. I want them to take care of business and I want to do what is right by them. They have always treated me well, but this is the 4th bike I have bought since 09.

My question is this.....Would I be out of line in asking for an esp ?

or at least on the engine depending on the fix?

I mentioned to him that according to the trip summary, I only got 25 mpg and used almost half a tank in 60 miles.

He said that is a separate issue.

I think it may be tied in with the other one. If an extended tear down or engine replace, should I ask for a loaner bike if they don't offer one?

Thanks for the opinions and comments. I know it is going to be an awesome trike. When I get to ride it.

Steve

 

[Capt.Bob]

I got a call from the dealer this morning.

They rode the bike and found that I do have an oil leak (duh) .

It appeared to be coming through the breather. They tested it without the breather and found no leak, with the breather there is a leak. They theorize that something was left out of the head, possibly an o ring or a seal. The Moco has a guy onsite this morning to begin tearing the engine down or at least the upper ends. So far , they are full steam ahead on a fix. I want them to take care of business and I want to do what is right by them. They have always treated me well, but this is the 4th bike I have bought since 09.

My question is this.....Would I be out of line in asking for an esp ?

or at least on the engine depending on the fix?

I mentioned to him that according to the trip summary, I only got 25 mpg and used almost half a tank in 60 miles. He said that is a separate issue.

I think it may be tied in with the other one. If an extended tear down or engine replace, should I ask for a loaner bike if they don't offer one?

Thanks for the opinions and comments. I know it is going to be an awesome trike. When I get to ride it.

Steve

Steve, Sorry to hear about the initial findings on your leak. You are asking several questions that I think would be best addressed with either the Sales Manager, General Manager or owner of the dealership you bought the trike from.

If it were me, I would formulate a strategy as to why I was asking for certain accommodations and would go to the highest decision maker in the dealership that I had a relationship with and attempt to get some/all of the concessions that you mentioned. I would think that the dealership and/or the MOCO would be very interested in keeping an early adopter very happy with the roll-out of a new engine platform that has produced some poor performance in less than 100 miles of use.

These things happen for all manufactured goods at some times in their production cycles and the manufacturers build in cash reserves to help keep their purchasers happy.

 

[Mykneesbehurtin]

My buddies 16 Street glide did the same thing,ended up that one of the return oil holes thru the cly never got drilled thru at the engine plant,they over nighted a new cly in and that was 5000 trouble free miles ago,hope your issues are solved quickly.As far as ESP they wouldnt let me transfer mine from the 16 to the 17 (new engine design) so they will refund my money,and by the way it runs concurrent with your existing factory warranty,so when this 17 gets about 6 months from the warranty fro running out i will buy it then.

 

[Steve on 3]

Steve, Sorry to hear about the initial findings on your leak. You are asking several questions that I think would be best addressed with either the Sales Manager, General Manager or owner of the dealership you bought the trike from. If it were me, I would formulate a strategy as to why I was asking for certain accommodations and would go to the highest decision maker in the dealership that I had a relationship with and attempt to get some/all of the concessions that you mentioned. I would think that the dealership and/or the MOCO would be very interested in keeping an early adopter very happy with the roll-out of a new engine platform that has produced some poor performance in less than 100 miles of use. These things happen for all manufactured goods at some times in their production cycles and the manufacturers build in cash reserves to help keep their purchasers happy.

Agreed Bob.

I don't want to be out of line with my requests. I don't want to be a dick. At the same time, I have a decent investment in something that didn't even make it home. The esp would be to protect from damages done which may not show up until the 24/24 warranty was expired. The loaner would be simply for the inconvenience of not having a bike to ride through no fault of my own. I have a great relationship with the owner Chris Preston who instructed my sales guy to "do what he had to do to put me on that trike"

I trust they will do what is fair but wondered how others think I should proceed and what is fair and equitable.

The loaner they will probably do ( It might even be my trade in.

)

Thanks for your reply

Steve

 

[ronc4424]

Steve,I felt your pain

Not impressed

I traded my vtx 1800 trike w/Motortrike kit for a superior blue one on 7/3/15.

I put 74 miles on it to my home.

Got up on Sat.

morning and adjusted the front & rear shifters.

Took it down the road to check the shifting. It was perfect. As I was pulling into my driveway the engine sounde like it had a hung lifter.

Called the dlrshp and they were closed until Tues. Needless to say my long holiday wknd s##ked. I trailered itto the dlrshp on Tue. and they said they have had a batch of bad lifters in the Free. I left it there and they would call me when they found out anything.

Got a call on Wed. and was told they were going to change out the lifters.

I called them back and asked if I could upgrade to the Screaming Eagle lifters and they said no problem if I would pay the difference of $121.00. I said go for it.

I received a call later that afternoon and was told the motor was junk ( metal bits ) and they have to send it back to the factory and they would transfer my vin #'s to new engine and ship it back.

The dealer called me yesterday and said I'm all set. I am going out of town until the first week of august so I told them to just put it in the corner and I will see you when I get back.

I've had 2 harleys ( problems ) up to 1980 and then I had a Kawi and then 3 Hondas which all were bullet proof.

I'm pushing 72 and figured what the hell, I'll make my last ride a H-D. Needless to say I'm not a happy camper.Twenty seven and change ( trunk guard & windshield plus freight )I really expected more from the Motor Company.....RonC...​

All the dealer did for me was to install all my accessories without charging any labor. They said MoCo couldn't ( or wouldn't ) do anything!..............RonC

 

[Steve on 3]

Ron,

Sorry you had the problems. This is my 4th new HD since 09 and al the others have been bullet proof. I think anything produced by man has the capability of being screwed up. In this case it happens to be something we area very passionate about. And a trike, be it Honda, Kawa, Stallion, Slingshot HD are not inexpensive toys.

I'll let them do what they need to do.

Thanks for your comments

Steve

 

[njtrike]

Steve my buddies always say that if you buy a new Harley when they come out with a new model your kind of letting yourself exposed to some expected stress due to new model problems. I saw this occur on the 2014's. In any case I would be asking my friend at the dealer to shoot me a new trike. If they can make one that won't run more than 100 miles than HD needs some heat. This is a heck of a way to treat a good customer and a friend of the dealer. Let them know you are friends with a good lawyer. Seeing your story makes me happy with my 2010. At age 72 with 53k on the triglide that has been trouble free I'm willing to say a few extra prayers to the HD Gods for you. They need to get you another one. You shouldn't even have to ask. Here's hoping you receive what you paid for.

NJ

 

[Capt.Bob]

Steve my buddies always say that if you buy a new Harley when they come out with a new model your kind of letting yourself exposed to some expected stress due to new model problems. I saw this occur on the 2014's.

In any case I would be asking my friend at the dealer to shoot me a new trike.

If they can make one that won't run more than 100 miles than HD needs some heat. This is a heck of a way to treat a good customer and a friend of the dealer. Let them know you are friends with a good lawyer. Seeing your story makes me happy with my 2010. At age 72 with 53k on the triglide that has been trouble free I'm willing to say a few extra prayers to the HD Gods for you. They need to get you another one. You shouldn't even have to ask. Here's hoping you receive what you paid for.

NJ

Steve, I am not sure if I would jump to the remedy that njtrike suggested right off the bat.

However, if they have to go deep into the engine, disturb all kinds of new stuff and put even the slightest amount of scratches on that new ride, then I think njtrike's suggestion to ask for a new trike might be in order? That is a tough call and it sounds like you are trying to be reasonable with the dealer.

I don't like to play the "lawyer card" because I think that just sets up and adversarial relationship. They (the dealer) in turn need to be reasonable with you if it involves too much downtime and the possibility of an unreliable new trike with extensive engine re-work in the field.

 

[Steve on 3]

Thanks Bob,

According to tech "it seems to be coming from the front cylinder in the vicinity of the air cleaner. When they removed the air cleaner and rode, no oil leak . Put the AC back on and it leaked. They removed the front cylinder and went over it piece by piece and could find nothing out of place.

They replaced the front cylinder with new gaskets, o rings and seals and are going to test ride about 50 miles if the rain from the outer edges of the Hurricane Matthew subside. Tech doing the work is a Master Tech who has been with HD since 2002 and is the shop foreman. He takes care of the owner's bike. Long list of certs and is the best tech they have. I would feel better if he had found something. It would put my mind at rest.

Also mentioned to him that I was only getting 25.9 mpg on the 60 mile ride home per the trip summary function on the Boom Box.

That doesn't seem right even for a new engine.

Hopefully they will get it fixed and back to me.

I will keep y'all posted.

I think I will get more done by being nice than by demanding a new bike or something. Once you let that Genie out , it's hard to get him back in the bottle.

Steve

 

[MikeyTX]

Jail house lawyers

Gotta love it. The oem warranty is ironclad nationwide. As long as the mo co fixes the issue within a reasonable period of time, that is all that is required. It is more than obvious from the op's posts that this is being done. Threatening legal action when it is not justified would simply make the op look like a fool and if anything, alienate the service department at the servicing dealer. Not exactly what one wants to do in this situation. If, and only if the same issue should occur again successively over a period of time would the possibility enter into the occasion of filing under the lemon law of his state. I speak from experience with the original twin cam in the Ultra Classic I purchased new the year the engine was introduced at Sturgis.

 

[rhino 2]

Gotta love it. The oem warranty is ironclad nationwide. As long as the mo co fixes the issue within a reasonable period of time, that is all that is required. It is more than obvious from the op's posts that this is being done. Threatening legal action when it is not justified would simply make the op look like a fool and if anything, alienate the service department at the servicing dealer.

Yep once someone yells, ''Lawyers'' The whole process will grind down to a halt....

Remember you can catch more Fly's with Honey' Then you can with vinegar....

In Jersey though we find we catch more fly's with dead squirrels, Especially in the summer..

 

[geezerglide11441]

Steve my buddies always say that if you buy a new Harley when they come out with a new model your kind of letting yourself exposed to some expected stress due to new model problems. I saw this occur on the 2014's.

In any case I would be asking my friend at the dealer to shoot me a new trike.

If they can make one that won't run more than 100 miles than HD needs some heat. This is a heck of a way to treat a good customer and a friend of the dealer. Let them know you are friends with a good lawyer. Seeing your story makes me happy with my 2010. At age 72 with 53k on the triglide that has been trouble free I'm willing to say a few extra prayers to the HD Gods for you. They need to get you another one. You shouldn't even have to ask. Here's hoping you receive what you paid for.

NJ

Basically disagree with njtrike regarding a Lawyer at this stage!!

However always leave this bullet in your gun as a last resort (my personal opinion for whatever it is worth!!). It sounds like your dealer is trying to take care of you, however, I would sit down and formulate a check sheet to identify your issues/desires and stick to them when you approach the "powers to be" - i.e.

OWNER!! I would also respect the Dealers/Owners staff management and only go directly to the Owner when all else fails!!

Good luck, as it sounds like they are trying to do the right thing!!

Roger

 

[MikeyTX]

Yep once someone yells, ''Lawyers'' The whole process will grind down to a halt....

Remember you can catch more Fly's with Honey' Then you can with vinegar....

In Jersey though we find we catch more fly's with dead squirrels, Especially in the summer..

I thought the whole idea was to shut down either the Holland tunnel or the GWB .......

 

[rhino 2]

I thought the whole idea was to shut down either the Holland tunnel or the GWB .......

:Shrug: Huh! :Shrug:

 

[Steve on 3]

Update to the update

Harley rep tore down my bike front cylinder where they determined the leak was coming from. . Had everything checked for cracks or defects in production of the parts. Don't know if it was xrayed or exactly what test but he said they didn't find any defects on the machine. Checked all the seals, o rings and gaskets. re-assembled with new seals, gaskets and o rings. They test rode it about 70 miles and no leaks. So I will pick it up in two days. Harley rep said take it and ride the crap out of it. I got 2 years to break it.

If it hasn't broken by then, it isn't going to.

We are going to have a discussion about an ESP when I get down there.

I think they did what was reasonable and I am satisfied.

Steve

 

[Capt.Bob]

Harley rep tore down my bike front cylinder where they determined the leak was coming from.

.

Had everything checked for cracks or defects in production of the parts. Don't know if it was xrayed or exactly what test but he said they didn't find any defects on the machine. Checked all the seals, o rings and gaskets. re-assembled with new seals, gaskets and o rings. They test rode it about 70 miles and no leaks. So I will pick it up in two days. Harley rep said take it and ride the crap out of it. I got 2 years to break it.

If it hasn't broken by then, it isn't going to.

We are going to have a discussion about an ESP when I get down there. I think they did what was reasonable and I am satisfied.

Steve

Congrats on them stopping the leak.

The only thing I cannot understand is what caused the leak in the first place? I would press the dealership and the Harley rep to get a more definitive answer.

We are ALL very interested in their findings.

I think the subject of some ESP accommodation might be in order. Not sure that I would press for a total freebie but would definitely expect them to seriously discount that sucker. After all, it is a profit margin item and if they sold it to you at actual dealer cost, that might be fair for all parties?

 

[Steve on 3]

Thanks Fuzzy

 

[roadking2]

Steve my buddies always say that if you buy a new Harley when they come out with a new model your kind of letting yourself exposed to some expected stress due to new model problems. I saw this occur on the 2014's.

In any case I would be asking my friend at the dealer to shoot me a new trike.

If they can make one that won't run more than 100 miles than HD needs some heat. This is a heck of a way to treat a good customer and a friend of the dealer. Let them know you are friends with a good lawyer. Seeing your story makes me happy with my 2010. At age 72 with 53k on the triglide that has been trouble free I'm willing to say a few extra prayers to the HD Gods for you. They need to get you another one. You shouldn't even have to ask. Here's hoping you receive what you paid for.

NJ

Shoot you a new trike?

Threaten them with a lawyer? Your suggestions are a sure way to ruin any relationship he may have had and assures him of never getting a good deal at that dealership ever again.

They are working on it and they will probably get it resolved shortly. I think your remedy is a little over the top.

 

[Steve on 3]

Update to the update to the update

Went to pick the trike up today. Was told again that they didn't find anything. I had carried one set of keys and fob and left with the trike so that they could start it. Got there and they took it to the gas station and refilled the tank. They said they had ridden 60 miles with no problems. I said good. Fixed it and I am good to go, Gave the wife the key and fob that had been with the bike and she went to her car. My fob would not disarm the security. I told the service guy and he said probably the fob battery, I will get one. Came back and did not have one. I said ok I have one and will install.

Should have lnown something was not right.

Went next door to Quaker Steak and lube for supper.

Opened mayo for burger and squeezed it and it popped and squirted the wife with mayo.

She isn't happy. Halfway through the meal, I sat my glass down and promptly spilled a full glass of tea on the table. Should have quit while I was ahead.

Left and got exactly 11.4 miles down the road and the check engine light and temp light came on. Stopped, pulled over and let it cool. Texted sales guy. No response, called sales guy..no response. By this time I am very pissed.

Decided I would take the trike back to dealer and see if they had a key drop, leave it outside and call them in morning. Eureka, someone is there.

Tried to leave keys with him and he said he couldn't accept them. He was finance guy.

I threw both sets of keys on his desk and said it's outside service. He asked what I wanted him to do.

Told him fix my damn trike. He said no what to do tonight. I said either put it inside or leave it outside I don't care. It is insured but you have the keys so if something happens to it, I am looking to the dealer to make it right.

I am to the point that they have ridden it more than me and have had it more than me. Right now I want a new motor or new trike or my trade in back and my check back. I think this trike is snake bit.

What are your thoughts?

What would you ask for?

 

[Gone2Three]

Dang Steve, your a patient man for sure! With all that's happened I'd say your entitled to another new trike, not the torn down and still not fixed again one!!! :AGGHH: with the amount of money and time you've spent I wouldn't except any less than that or a really good discount, with repair and the ESP. I'll keep my fingers crossed

 

[Capt.Bob]

Went to pick the trike up today.

Was told again that they didn't find anything.

I had carried one set of keys and fob and left with the trike so that they could start it. Got there and they took it to the gas station and refilled the tank. They said they had ridden 60 miles with no problems. I said good. Fixed it and I am good to go, Gave the wife the key and fob that had been with the bike and she went to her car. My fob would not disarm the security. I told the service guy and he said probably the fob battery, I will get one. Came back and did not have one. I said ok I have one and will install.

Should have lnown something was not right.

Went next door to Quaker Steak and lube for supper. Opened mayo for burger and squeezed it and it popped and squirted the wife with mayo.

She isn't happy. Halfway through the meal, I sat my glass down and promptly spilled a full glass of tea on the table.

Should have quit while I was ahead.

Left and got exactly 11.4 miles down the road and the check engine light and temp light came on. Stopped, pulled over and let it cool. Texted sales guy. No response, called sales guy..no response. By this time I am very pissed.

Decided I would take the trike back to dealer and see if they had a key drop, leave it outside and call them in morning. Eureka, someone is there.

Tried to leave keys with him and he said he couldn't accept them. He was finance guy. I threw both sets of keys on his desk and said it's outside service.

He asked what I wanted him to do. Told him fix my damn trike. He said no what to do tonight.

I said either put it inside or leave it outside I don't care. It is insured but you have the keys so if something happens to it, I am looking to the dealer to make it right.

I am to the point that they have ridden it more than me and have had it more than me. Right now I want a new motor or new trike or my trade in back and my check back. I think this trike is snake bit.

What are your thoughts?

What would you ask for?

Steve, I think it is time to have a serious one-on-one conversation with your owner friend behind close doors with no shouting if possible. There are some red flags raised when you were told that they found nothing wrong. Why would an engine with nothing wrong puke oil in the first place? Furthermore, one would wonder why your new M8 engine is throwing a check engine code and overheating?

Did you pull the radiator cover on the right lower fairing panel to see what the fluid level was?

I would think that some of the frustration would be coming from not being able to go more than 11 miles before these new faults cropped up and also not yet able to go 100 miles total on a new trike. I don't know what your lemon laws are in your particular State but I would look them up before your next meeting with the dealership.

Some State's laws are more specific about down times and the amount of problems a customer experiences before the Lemon Laws are applicable. I would certainly do a quick but thorough read of those laws before you meet up with the owner.

So far, it appears that both you and the dealer have been reasonable in your approach to solving the initial problem. At this point, there are really a number of different decisions that both you and the dealer can make to help you become a happier customer with this cropping up of a second set of problems on a newly worked-on new trike.

Clear communication and problem solving between you and the owner will be the best next approach to getting things squared away. Hopefully, that meeting will go well and you will both walk out with smiles in whatever strategies you two come up with.

 

[Capt.Bob]

The darn editor wouldn't let me add to my previous post that there may be lawyers reading this that would have a professional understanding of your rights and remedies. That is always one option but introducing a third-party may or may not be advisable depending on how your meeting with your dealership owner goes? I couldn't begin to comment on the advisability of that approach. I hope you will remember that it is easier for those of us who are just reading this to give all kinds of advice but we are not there on the ground and don't know the players. You do, and so you really likely have the best understanding of how to get past this rugged situation in a manner that will make you happy with the sale. Much good luck in the coming days and know that your Harley brothers/sisters are thinking positive thoughts for a good resolution of your problems. Thanks for letting us know what is happening. I hope you get to the bottom of why the problems have been occurring?

 

[Gone2Three]

Amen brother Bob! :Agree:

 

[1dn5up]

M8 -new motor, new electronics. So new that it's going to take dealer tecs a year to get acquainted with it, even though the MOCO trained them, or maybe familiarized them. Like it was all stated before, some one needs to be the guinea pig on new production, Personaly I stick to my 2 year rule.
Good luck, you will need patience.

 

[ROAD DOG]

GET YOUR TRADE IN & CHECK BACK & RUN ! Wait five years & then buy A new one .

 

[Steve on 3]

A good nights sleep didn't make anything better so far. I appreciate the support from you guys. This is my 5th new Harley since 2005. Never any problems with any one of them except this demon bike. I'd have it exorcised if it would make it to a church. I now have no confidence it will make it to the city limits much less anywhere I would want to travel to. I'll see what today brings and post an update on what they say. Thanks for the suggestions and support.

Steve

 

[PosseRider]

Best of luck.

 

[gerald martin]

bad trike

I am very sorry for your troubles I know they are frustrating. I had a similar problem with a new 2010 street glide Harley trike I bought. They didn't seem to be able to fix it and all the yelling and complaining to the dealership and to Harley did nothing. I waited a week and went to a different dealer and traded it in for a new one. when asked why I was trading I said my wife hated the color. It cost me $2000.00 difference but I thought it was worth it and I had no problems with the new one.

 

[Capt.Bob]

Steve, I have almost wet my pants in anticipation of hearing the outcome of your new trike situation with the dealer. The potential incontinence may be more linked to my aging but then again, I have half held my breath hoping that you come out of this situation with a big grin on your face. I know that there are lots of people pulling for you both here and on another website where you posted your situation. Hope this day is bringing more rays of sunshine